Almost half of all animators KyoAni has worked on this episode.
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Anonymous2013-03-27 12:56
>>6
Has Tamako been their only recent series with such a large staff list?
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Anonymous2013-03-27 13:00
RE: More Chuu2koi
Lots of misunderstandings here. First of all, there is no second season officially announced, they just said there's more to come. Considering the rebroadcast was already confirmed and there's an OVA to come already, it most likely means it'll be a sequel, but there's no official word on that. I assume they're being this vague because the project is still VERY FAR AWAY; you know how long KyoAni's production cycles are, so unless this was planned as a split cours since the very beginning it means we won't be seeing this until... winter? Fall at most. And that means there's still a huge chance Kadokawa might sneak in a new KyoAni project beforehand, something many people have been expecting since their last series was almost a year ago.
As to why KyoAni would announce this now even if it's not their immediate project, you should easily realize the reason. Do you honestly think Pony Canyon would allow an ad for Kadokawa's next show right after their current series ended? No one would want the announcement for a rival company's project in between their commercials for anime merch. And hell, considering the time lapse between Chuu2Koi's announcement and its premiere, I have no idea why you'd expect this to come to fruition anytime soon.
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Anonymous2013-03-27 13:18
Do you still think there's going to be a KyoAni/kadokawa show coming soon? I find that doubtful.
>>9
Any reason to believe that? Hyouka's disc sales are good, the novels sold an insane amount compared to what they did before and even the manga sales skyrocketted, especially with the volume that had the OVA bundled in. All of that straight to Kadokawa's pocket. I don't see why they'd feel like breaking their partnership with KyoAni when it more often than not nets them a lot of money.
>>13
They're definitely taking a break on the upcoming season, and at this point I'm assuming they won't have anything this summer either. Tamako Market suffered greatly from pre-airing promotion (it was announced barely 3 weeks before its premiere, even though it's an original project) so I think they'll make a point of building up the hype for their upcoming projects way before they start.
That said, I still don't expect more Chuu2 before the next winter season so there should be something else before.
No outstanding cuts in the Tamako finale, but production values are solid. Now time for KyoAni to take a break and hopefully there will be some well-made shows this coming season to pick up the slack.
Just finished Niji-iro Hotaru. It was great, and I have to say that it was a sakuga movie through and through, not just because the animation was stylish and awesome (also the backgrounds and art direction were mind-boggling), but because the story is otherwise typical oscarbait, but is given new room to breath and feel fresh thanks to the visual execution alone (everything else down to the OST has been done tons of times before).
The visuals also are in full support of the main theme of the film, which unsurprisingly comes to layers upon layers of mono no aware discourses intertwined with each other. I like that stuff, so I liked it, but even if you don't care for that type of melancholic stuff, the effort that was made to convey it through every area of the film has to be commended at the very least.
I didn't identify animators or anything of the sort because I'm not really good at it, but there were a lot of segments of really lively and flowing character animation. The whole thing looked like Hisashi Mori's style, but it was also not as consistent due to the stark differences in timing between cuts. I see the animators were left to do their thing.
Ohira's scene was amazing as always, and I really liked the final sequence with the fireflies. Not technically amazing, but
the use of colour was really effective there and managed to pull off a visual spectacle while not losing the hand-made charm the film has going for it.
Also, the fact that it's only DVD doesn't hurt it at all. It looked pretty good (although the style probably helps that), and I'd even say it further reinforces the ideas of the film, lol.
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Anonymous2013-03-29 6:02
>mono no aware discourse
shut up uou pretentious twit you have no fucking idea what you're talking about go back to neogaf
Different sakuganon here but yes, Niji-iro Hotaru was very well directed. It's been a while since I watched it but generally the style fits the scenes and the atmosphere and ambiance is very idillic, nostalgic and transient/dreamy (= mono no aware). I didn't like Ohira's rotoscoping though. And before someone tells me he didn't embellish a rotoscope with that scene: I'll smack your shit through the internet!~ That shit was rotoscoped. And butt ugly.
I mean, everything revolves around reminiscing for the past, talking about how time passes and stuff comes to an end, and "living your life to the fullest because it's short". Stuff you can see in a lot of anime to some degree. The story takes that basic idea and develops it over different areas, like the village going away and being replaced by modern stuff, the fireflies and all the romanticism around them, the memory losing plot point, and the backstories of the two leads. They all revolve around letting go and moving ahead, while maintaining a sort of melancholy for the past. Even the final written message relates to this topic. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mono_no_aware
I'd have guessed most people are familiar with the concept, but whatever.
Yes, it was well directed. I'd say the storyboard was in service of the animation, with wide pans and static shots that made use of animated expression. It was all very succint, and maybe a bit cheesy in some parts, but nothing really wrong with it. The main appeal of the movie is still the animation, of course.
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Anonymous2013-03-29 7:13
>>49
How do you know it's rotoscoped? It was classic Ohira fare to me, right down to the timing. And well, in a movie as stylized as Niji-iro Hotaru, suddenly going all realistic and heightening Japanese facial features was bound to be a bit disrupting, but I thought it fitted the context of the scene and was very good as animation by itself.
Juts look at it.
It's obviously rotoscoped, you dumbfuck.
You must be a fucking idiot wannabe namedropping sakugafag to think that it's not rotoscoped.
The movement is uncannily real and the timing reminds me a lot of those limited animation rotoscopes that were posted in the previous thread on carcom. Also, the proportions and facial features are drastically different from anything else in the film but more importantly, look like outlines of real faces. It's just that the lines are sketchier, rough. It can't be anything but an embellished totoscoped. Don't tell me bullshit like "he used references" because the timing and outlines don't look like that when referenced.
The cuts also look way different than anything Ohira has done before, timing wise especially. The whole thing screams rotoscope. And I wouldn't mind it, but it's jarring and doesn't fit the scene or the film at all.
Exactly this is what I'm talking about. The first one is rotoscoping done on 3s, I'm sure of it. He skipped frames when tracing. Compare with 57 which is fully animated rotoscoping. The timing is just too similar, just choppier.
The second clip with them walking on the road and the mororcycle has such a strikingly different timing. That typical, skimpy but smooth, melty Ohira flavour in the movement. "Realistic" motion, but not really real.
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Anonymous2013-03-29 8:18
Hi guys , i only know this faction of 4chan here
Is there some same thread where you can share your creations (flash games, drawings whenever) there?
I know it's off topic but i know some people there.
I mean , a cool place free of trolls and stupid posters
>>52 please answer my question. I want to see Inoue's animation so badly since this was announced. I saw some people filming the trailer at TAF, but there is nothing on youtube.
the first clip does look pretty weird but it doesn't look roto either. I'm guessing Ohira was trying to keep things relatively on-model because doing his typical surreal heavy movement with deforming features wouldn't fit the context of the scene.
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Anonymous2013-03-29 11:52
Hayao MIyazaki and Hideaki Anno talk about rotoscope and Shinya Ohira
It' so easy to spot the timing difference between a rotoscoped sequence and scenes in Jin-Roh that your whole post is unintentionally bad in a way you did not mean it.
Does anyone watch Ixion Saga DT?
Saito Yoshinari was the AD for episode 24.
Interesting effects animations here and there.
Some nice angles as well for some shots.
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Anonymous2013-03-29 22:49
Don't expect The 2 Queens pilot online soon. For the moment it's just for festivals / professionals.
Aw..
This sucks.
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Anonymous2013-03-29 23:01
pilot ?
It's what ? a tv series ? or a film
I'm lost (again)
Slowly downloading Little Witch Academia's ts is going to kill me. The massive BD iso is being uploaded by a friend who is currently dead because he fought hard to get this!
Their earlier works didn't have swarms of idiots praising them for the fantastic flubbing mouths over lush backgrounds and overfiltered images to catch my attention. I only seriously got into anime in 2005, and at that point I really didn't give a damn who made my entertainment rations.
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Anonymous2013-03-30 9:26
After looking at the PVs for Valvrave and Majestic Prince, it seems that CGI mecha may not be so bad after all.
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Anonymous2013-03-30 10:07
And then you see the first 2 episodes of Suisei no Gargantia and forget about CGI mecha not being that bad. But other than that, those episodes were very good. Nothing outstanding but the settei and art direction is cool, animation is good, great chara designs and etc etc There is a lot of beam spam in episode 1. It's kinda like Gunbuster/Diebuster meets Nadia. The finale could be some great stuff. I'm expecting some nice scenes from this now.
Cool shit, seriously. I wasn't interested in this beforehand and only tried it out because that pre-release event happened, but I changed my mind now. Also, episode 2 storyboard was top-tier:
I "love" this guy. He does nothing and would be nothing without Koyama Hirokazu. His designs suck ass before Hirokazu puts his hands on them. And yeah, I was interested in that too. Girls' Work it is I think.
It's not so much the CG itself that is a problem as much as the mecha design. They look like giant toys. So the movements end up looking awkward. The CG itself isn't bad technically (up to par or better than in Valverave, as much as we've seen from that) but the design is... mehhhh.
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Anonymous2013-03-30 11:28
>>100
Girls' Work isn't really a thing yet aside from some promo images, Sakura no Ondo is the Hirao/Takeuchi project.
Yes, yes. They're both TT something and a takeuchi. I was confusing the names. I was not talking about the animator.
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Anonymous2013-03-30 11:40
>>107
I remember seeing a trailer for it, I'm pretty sure some parts showed some animation that looked like Takeuchi's. Can't remember the rest of the staff listing though.
>>114
Definitely worth the hype. The only complaint I can see popping up is in regards to the overly simplistic story, but in my honest opinion (and I'm guessing everyone here's), strong enough visuals can carry an entire OVA.
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Anonymous2013-03-30 15:29
So what's with the elitism with LWA' upload? We want to see it too!
>>116
Twitter sakuga circle being twitter sakuga circle.
They really disgust me with their elitism and "we are better than the rest of anime fandom" mindset sometimes.
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Anonymous2013-03-30 17:13
Well. its not like they are the only ones who have the BR, we will see rips sometime soon, waiting for a more few days wont hurt anybody.
Just a brief clarification here: a Japanese friend of mine was the guy who bought the Anime Mirai BD and ripped it. He uploaded the ts and linked it to everyone who asked him, and I have no problem giving you the link as well. Just keep in mind that it's over 8GB for only 30 minutes of content https://mega.co.nz/#F!HQcCTIhY!QhmOXS5Zcicp7esbOr5FQA
There's a 720p encode of it floating around that's being PM'd on twitter, but that's on someone else's google docs and I don't feel comfortable giving it away because you know how they are about copyright. Let me reupload it real fast and I'll post it here.
Bari: I want to skip Spring and Summer shows and get to the Fall shows already
KenO: We do have This and That coming don't we!
Bari: Handrawn 2D drawn robots will strike back
KenO: Finally the time has come! I'm really pumped for it!!
Bari: I'm really pumped for it as well!
yada yada, they both carry on being really hyped for it.
Potentially 2 shows this fall with 2D mechs in it. Hope might not all be lost!
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Anonymous2013-03-30 19:22
Sakuga 2013 is becoming more real by the minute.
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Anonymous2013-03-30 20:03
Hi guys, I'm the super elitist twitter jerk, who actually went out of his way to bug a friend to give him a quick how to for enconding, then froze for 2 hours by the open window so the laptop wouldn't melt down listening to the damn thing confusing itself for a jet engine.
I pretty much gave the link to a stream, DDL and even a torrent on IRC and to anyone on twitter who asked, since it's being subbed anyways (and probably soon too), I didn't want to spread my shit encode.
However, judging by your reactions, this is the last time I ever bother to do something like this. Next time, I'm watching the .ts and posting the screenshots while watching EVERYONE whine. And this is the reason I didn't post it here nor do I read these boards. Because you are a bunch of self entitled whining pieces of shit.
P.S: All thanks got to the bro who went and bought the bluray in the first place.
>>134
Not your blog.
I appreciate what you did, but if you can't handle two people calling you an elitist you should stay away from the internet before you hurt yourself.
The raws would have been out in a couple of days either way, so stop acting like a fucking saint.
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Anonymous2013-03-30 21:21
>>134
I can tell you don't read these boards. Believe it or not, most of the people discussing animation here are pretty nice people who don't sound like jerks, unlike you and your "you are a bunch of self entitled whining pieces of shit".
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Anonymous2013-03-30 21:43
You guys went out of your way to call people on twitter elitist jerks, because you didn't get your shit RIGHT THE FUCK NOW. If someone poked me specifically, only reason I didn't reply is because I passed out for a few hours.
Really, it's a shit encode done as a favor to two people on twitter and since it was already done, I gave it to couple of other sakuga regulars. The high quality encode with subs will probably be out soon, so why spread around a half-ass job when it deserves better.
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Anonymous2013-03-30 21:49
BAAAAAAAAW GIVE US THE ENCODE
BAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAW YOU'RE ENTITLED WHINY CUNTS
yes guys, let's fight amongst ourselves, it's not like we're some niche ass fanbase comprised of 20 people at most. Makes no fucking sense creating cliques or whining about other people.
>>140
Correct. Because everybody knows that every single poster on 4chan is represented by a few posts made in whatever thread. This is common knowledge. Every single user in this thread is a self-entitled jerk and we went out of our way to call people on twitter elitist jerks.
Seriously though. We are not represented by the people that talked to you on twitter. You have a problem with them, so you complain to us and not to them?
Fuck off you attentionwhoring faggot. Your presence in this thread is unwanted and you go out of your way to offend people that have done nothing to you.
>>120 here
I think you're an elitist faggot because of your attitude(and it really shows in this thread and on your twitter's timeline).
I don't even care about your encode and I has never asked you for your encode since I know I'll get one anyway.
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Anonymous2013-03-30 22:05
>all this drama because of LWA
guys
pls stop
seriously
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Anonymous2013-03-30 22:06
>>140
I'm >>116, I was just making a joke bro. Chill. I asked because I know some twitter people post here, and I was sure I could get someone to answer me/share the RAW.
Shit encode notwithstanding, you got the show, and if someone (not you) is gushing over it in public it's only natural that other people who were hyped for it will react to that and want to watch it too. Anyone who actually cares for encodes will download it again when subs are out, and the people who don't notice it will be happy with yours either way.
If someone else was being an asshole on this thread I don't think it should really bother you, we don't even know if he was actually whining or just trying to start shit up, we got a fair share of trolls in the thread. But one guy doesn't represent the majority of us here.
So, anyway, thanks for uploading the .ts and the encode! There's no need for hostility among the niche.
Iso deserves better then a couple of "orgasm" posts. I say we dedicate an entire thread to just talking about how great he is
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Anonymous2013-03-30 22:37
>that feel when you're getting credited for Kick-Heart
I WANT TO SEE MY NAME ON THE WEBSITE. Dunno how long it'll be till the BD comes in the mail, aren't they doing film festivals first?
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Anonymous2013-03-30 22:53
Probably May? I think they delayed simply because of festival submission rules, it'd be an odd move to show it at festivals before the people who chipped in saw it.
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Anonymous2013-03-30 23:36
Yeah, I don't get what the deal with Little Witch Academia was. The animation is very good, definitely the best anime mirai short thus far buuuuut I expected a lot more with the whole monkeys and bananas reaction. I guess this is one of those cases where the hype and appraisal is based solely on "names". It's Yoshinari, so I'm going to call it JESUS CHRIST ONA SAMWITCH BITCHES! Really? Please stop overreacting like that. It just kills the fun when the hype is for nothing. I was pumped as SHIT and THEN some going into the short but then I just ended up hitting the wall like a truck. a
m sad. ;_;
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Anonymous2013-03-30 23:46
>expecting better
how much better are we talking
like Lal'C throwing a planet better? That's probably the best thing Yoshinari's ever done. But honestly, I just loved how great the character animation was, it wasn't just action scenes and FX. I also really loved the background animation in this, like when they're flying up the tower or running in the catacombs, you don't see much of that these days. The whole thing was consistently powerful, even if it didn't have a defining moneyshot cut (the taurus melting and the dragon transforming bits were fucking amazing though)
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Anonymous2013-03-31 1:40
>>151
Well, you've done an awful job at explaining why it's not that impressive while people have detailed why they loved it so I'm not sure why anyone should follow your "advice".
I think you might be misreading what I said. As for explaining anything, please wait while I go fetch my bag full of "I give a fuck". I will be back with a reply as soon as I find it.
>>154
It's easy to misread what you said because you have no point. The only information >>151 conveys is that you were underwhelmed. What is the answer to that? Pat you in the back?
If you don't want to bother explaining you argument, why do you even post?
I tend to think that twitter has become an IRC-like communication medium. But it is fully volatile and hard to follow whereas on IRC we can easily read the discussions, even the old ones.
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Anonymous2013-03-31 7:45
I liked, no, loved the background animation in "My Little Yoshinari Academia can't be this Hey Did That Giant Dragon Explode into a lame Butterfly Rainbow of Fireworks?"
There are people here who are often whining about traditional mechanical animation (or its absence, to be exact) so let me whine too will you? There has always been too little background animation in anything (except Yuasa who loves animating backgrounds - man of my soul) so thank you for the cherries on this cake Mr. YO YO(shinari)!.. YO!
Couldn't stand the speed lines. They generally look like shit in almost anything and they look worse in "My Little Yoshinari Academia can't be this Hey Why Are Those Holds so Long, Please Animate?" (Kanada style a shit? Kanada style a shit - yes I am that guy from the previous thread on /carcom/- stills and holds are not animation when they're noticeable and interrupt the flow of motion, and they make a scene with falling objects like girls and dragons really lame when nothing is actually falling, or moving). Where was I? Oh, speed lines.
Yes, they reminded me of those scenes in the Joshiraku OVA where they just slap these manga effects over anything - speed lines to make it dramatic, bubbly bubbles to make it fluffy - which looked pretty shitty, but that was the whole point because it was a gag. If there was an animation gag in Little Witch Academia (what did you expect another complaint disguised as a long ass caricature of a title, oniichan?) I must've missed it. Yes, manga is the cancer killing anime, with its visual shortcuts and symbols. If I wanted to fool myself into believing a still and some speed lines in the foreground and background equal motion, I'd just stick to manga. If you can make the motion, than do it, God Dammit!!
The character animation was goofy and cute. I liked that. Stuff like That Girl #1 (couldn't be bothered to remember their names) pulling the helmet out of her head with a *suimp* sound and a stretch. Deformed and expressive acting in few frames during the dialogues (yes, limited animation isn't always shitty. sometimes it's just limited) or nice body action during the catacomb exploration or when That Girl #1 runs to pick the Big Fucking Green Gem Magic Thingie in the tower with the dragon. This shit was cool. And best I liked the effects animation for all the magically bubbly wandy stuff. You know, the kira kira~ kyuuuuun they do with the wands. Or those fire things. Very cool motion (and also, very cool use of colour) - sparkly and fun. Except the fireworks. They looked like shit every time.
And........ that's it I guess. Pretty good short. And overall (not just animation/storyboarding/art direction/blah blah wise) I think it's my second favourite Young Animator/Anime Mirai short since Tensu Warashi in 2011.
Disclaimer: Being THIS MAD over anything is only done for oratoric purposes. Read between the lines. Sankyuuchuuu~
Now if you'll excuse me, I need to masturbate.
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Anonymous2013-03-31 7:55
The problems you list, they are pretty much ingrained as part of the anime medium. They are probably hold overs from the Tezuka era and how he defined limited animation.
Are you perhaps someone from a western animation mindset? Perhaps that's why you don't like these "shortcuts" and "tricks" anime uses.
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Anonymous2013-03-31 8:03
No, I am someone who enjoys animation in all its incarnation, ad-hoc cultural barriers be damned. It's not a matter of style at all. Shit animation is shit animation is shit animation. I am okay with looking past these things in a TV series, because the directors and animators actually have a couple of big reasons for employing them: budget and schedule. I am expecting a little more from a 25 minute "episode" that is done in no rush and was probably decently funded (which let's be honest, does come off in the very nice production - they didn't fund it by selling matchsticks).
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Anonymous2013-03-31 8:09
Oh, and just to illustrate my point further - Evangelion Shin Gekjouban: Q also has a couple of cuts or so with speed lines in the background during the final battles. I didn't mind it there because besides foregoing the background altogether for some dramatic lining, they're actually animated. And to make it even more clear, there are scenes like these in LWA too. Those I have no problem with. But the cuts with the MC falling or those cuts where dragon is "flying" next to the tower, cuts that are just made up of a series of holds and some speed lines - those are awful. That's manga bullshit, not animation. Levae it on paper please.
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Anonymous2013-03-31 8:11
Although even if I don't particularly mind those scenes I mentioned, I'm not particularly fond of them, either. They would've looked a lot better with an actual background instead of a smear of colours.
Sorry for tripple posting. No edit button is a pain in the ass.
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Anonymous2013-03-31 8:21
>>156
That would be cool to have a 'sakuga channel' on IRC. Twitter is like a playground and irc is more intimate to discuss.
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Anonymous2013-03-31 8:24
I think you're trying to deny anime's cultural baggage here. The language of manga is a cornerstone of what made anime what it is, what most of the directors and animators at the time worked with. Yes, speed-lines with holds, and most of the Kanada-style of animating can be attributed to manga's influence+shoestring budgets, but just because it's born of constraint doesn't mean it's less of an artform. The creative layouts that anime is known for came out of exploiting the lack of frames to max degree. It is only natural that some of this mixing later becomes a defining characteristic of the medium, to the point it's not even a matter of budget anymore.
I don't think a few scenes like that constitute shit animation, in the sense that the creators are satisfied with them and think that's the way to go (and so are the majority of the viewers). Questions about whether or not a background as opposed to a color is inherently better or worse ultimately boil down taste and preference.
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Anonymous2013-03-31 8:28
Hmm... Making a channel is easy. The thing about IRC is that it is a chatroom, and that has its share of suck. If you're not connected all the time you'll lose the discussion, whereas this board or twitter are more permanent. It may be more "intimate" but all that means is that it will degenerate into off-topic chatter really fast, with the sakuga mentions being degraded to perfunctory interruptions.
Oh, but if you guys want to make a room don't let me stop you! :)
Shingeki no Kyoujin looks really good. I wonder how consistent the quality will remain throughout the series.
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Anonymous2013-03-31 8:48
>>167
Yeah that's my main concern too, it'll generally degenerate to casual idle banter when sakuga is not the topic. Where as with the BBS we can keep it on topic for most part.
I mean if a channel is made I would come to idle every now and then, but I don't use IRC very often other than to download from XDCC bots and maybe ask someone something in a channel.
Takafumi Hori did some animation for LWA? Isn't he a veteran of some sort?
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Anonymous2013-03-31 11:49
>>176
This is the thing that confuses me about this project.
Several of the so called youngsters that are being "trained" are already established animators with lots of talent.
I've seen some animators on Twitter saying about what the deal with Animemirai actually is. They can't tell if the project's aim is to train youngsters, is it to promote creative projects? Why claim "youngsters" when several of the participating animators are 30+, shouldn't they be working with actual youngsters in their early 20s? Etc..
I mean I am glad such creative projects are being made but, to what extent are they being made for and for whose benefit?
Every one of these had at least one actual trainee (they're credited). The fact that you're not seeing more trainees is (you will not like this) because the studios do not give a fuck about training anyone. They're exploiting a loophole to get free cash for some side projects or some cool little winding out fare. The mentality is that anyone interested in animation will try to get into the industry regardless. The whole project is actually extra pocket money.
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Anonymous2013-03-31 14:03
>>179
So it's like:
submit proposal -> receive 38kk yen -> make OVA from 25kk yen -> profit.
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Anonymous2013-03-31 14:06
>>176 >>177
The idea is that young animators work alongside more experienced ones
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Anonymous2013-03-31 14:07
>>174 will the irc discussions be archived somewhere?
and there's not much to talk about. Might become more active when spring shows start
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Anonymous2013-03-31 15:26
The speedlines in LWA didn't annoy me at all because the actual characters were always consistently animated; I don't think using loop backgrounds would have looked better and we all know that's what they would have used instead.
The best part of the movie was the way in which the actual director was movement; every switch from cut to cut had a character moving in the direction of the switch, that gave the presentation a very smooth, natural feeling.
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Anonymous2013-03-31 15:33
>Have you seen LWA yet? It's one of the most animated non-movies I've seen.
This is not animation and there's nothing impressive about their "artristry" as drawings either, especially the first. Animating the rubble is not getting any points because that's not what you're going to pay attention to, since the drawing is panned upwardly and the dragon always stands out. And those speedlines look like shit as simple drawings as well. There's nothing to appreciate here artistically.
The fact that these cuts are from the climax of the short makes it worse. As for shoving the discussion into tastes and preferences, well then I'll just say I don't like these things, and I can't like them. But the cultural baggage has nothing to do with it. We'll habe to agree to disagree.
>>192
You know something, you're making a huge over something that appears so relatively short ammount of time in this episode. 99% of this episode was animated very well, why shit on the 1%?
As for taste yada yada, you need to stop acting like your opinion = fact. That's why so many people respond to you since you act as if your opinion is the only one that is correct, it's what annoyed me about your Kanada comments as well.
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Anonymous2013-03-31 19:56
Little Witch Academia isn't really "animation training fare",; it's in fact completely different from any other Anime Mirai project. It's a pilot. Plain and simple. It's a fucking pilot for the Little Witch Academia idea. They're already sellig merchandise. Yoshinari and Ootsuka both said that they would love to do more. They're advertising whenever they can. It's meant to make money in the long term, I'm sure of it.
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Anonymous2013-03-31 19:58
I;m not making a huge deal out of anything. You on the other hand are getting pathetically defensive.
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Anonymous2013-03-31 20:00
Did Death Billiards have any veteran animators working on it as well like LWA did?
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Anonymous2013-03-31 20:00
And you seriously need to lern how to read.
At least I'm making you discuss something. So deal with it.
Every one of these shorts does. They're not done by rookies. Some of the staff members (1 or 2 guys really) are new and they're using the projects to train them.
>The project aims to promote works where the animation studio retains rights to the work by allowing studios to do so with the finished products.
Basically, Trigger can do wahtever they want with Little Witch Academia. It's theirs.
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Anonymous2013-03-31 20:21
About Animemirai, I heard from one animator/animation instructor (he's not Japanese but he did some subcontract work for Japanese studios) that they didn't care much about training young animators. The studios just wanted to show what their staffs could do with decent budget and schedule.
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Anonymous2013-03-31 20:21
Well I wouldn't mind a proper series. But the short worked well as a standalone, unlike Arve Rezzle which really felt like a pilot episode/prologue.
>>216
It's probably "training" in the sense that it's animating experience, and due to the nature of the project it's free from all the constraints of typical TV anime that make it hard for the animators to hone their craft and do their best. I don't think Hori and the other two are actively coaching the rest of the animators, not anymore than any project in where young and old animators are co-working in the same place.
About a series, I'd prefer if they didn't. They will never top this short with a TV production. Maybe if they do some OVAs or a film...
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Anonymous2013-03-31 21:23
I wonder if Untitled Imaishi Project will be 12-13 or 24-26 episodes long. Probably 13.
A bit late to the LWA party, I thought it was good as I expected. Lively character animation and stylish effects animation all around. Yoshinari-style effects are wonderful to look at.
>>234
Even if it doesn't look good, the technique is unique and relevant to people interested in animation. Unless it ends up looking not only bad, but painfully generic, I think it's okay to have it at the sakuga@wiki.
Not the same guy but the only scene that stood out to me was the intro with Shining Chary/Chariot. A lot of the better cuts in LWA were repeats of cuts from that scene, like the arrow scene (Shining Shot?) with the dragon (except later it had a short transformation sequence as well).
yutapon is, in a way, the purest big-name animator that remains. everyone else has done direction work, illustration work, character design work or at least animation director work. yutapon does absolutely nothing but animate.
>>266 >>268
Inb4 he directs Anime Mirai 2014 project at BONES.
>>268
He directed, storyboarded and animation directed Gluttony fight from FMA movie.
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Anonymous2013-04-02 14:57
Is it me or is Hironori Tanaka getting worse with time? Maybe it is that he is working mostly on shitty anime, but most of his recent work is really rough and unpolished.
Where's this "weight" you're talking about? That's pretty standard motion, and there is a pretty similar cut in Vividbutts OP (who animated that?).
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Anonymous2013-04-02 16:12
>>271
Tanaka work is always depend in the studio he works with
look to his work with BONES Zetsuen, it was really good and detailed
But when he work with shitty studios like Shaft or A-1
with fucked up schedule, he just throw them with normal animation with no fucking details
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Anonymous2013-04-02 17:25
>But when he work with shitty studios like Shaft or A-1
Yo, I know what you mean but having scheduling problems more often than not doesn't make them shitty studios. Hell, they happen to be a pretty interesting bunch in regards to animation.
With the amount of work Tanaka produces, it's natural that not everything will be at the same level. Some stuff is going to be good, and great, especially when he works on films and has time to polish it. But a fair share of his work is probably filler he turns in for money, and while it's still better than the average mouth-flapping badly drawn shit you see on TV anime, it's by no means what Tanaka can actually offer.
I wonder if he'll direct a show someday, that would be interesting.
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Anonymous2013-04-02 20:20
>>283
It was just a test video, I'm sure the final version will be up soon.
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Anonymous2013-04-02 20:30
>>271
His work in Sasami-san episode 8 was not bad at all, in my opinion.
>>272
You should check out the first and last episode of Towa no Quon (besides the obvious amazing movie Sword of the Stranger). You're tripping if you think that's not putting weight in his scenes.
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Anonymous2013-04-02 22:35
>>295
Yeah, it's kind of a silly comparison. You may like one animator over another, but there's no doubt Nakamura is one of the very best animators in the scene.
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Anonymous2013-04-03 2:49
Why can't A-1 get their shit together when it comes to production schedules? You'd think that they'd be able to pull it off already since they've been around for several years.
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Anonymous2013-04-03 5:15
>>297
It's not like they always fuck them up, you've got things like SAO with seemingly smooth productions as well. They just make a crapton of shows and their general approach is just hiring more animators if the schedule is getting tight, which doesn't always work.
Yes, the picture took a while to load. And since it didn't load at first I went to the news section but nothing was written there about an anime. It appeared after I reloaded the page.
>>274
There are some animators out there that don't mind about sexual orientation.
Who cares anyway whether he is gay or not, that's too private. He is an awesome animator.
>>310
Chuunibyou got just one volume adapted didn't it?
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Anonymous2013-04-03 7:12
>>310
Chuu2Koi started production when only the first novel was out and used that as a loose base for the anime. It ended up being broadcasted when two novels had been released. Looks like a similar case this time around, assuming it's been on preproduction for a while.
hmmm... maybe yamanekai or blue mistook it then. But I really remember a cut in Fate/Zero(Saber vs Lancer) part being named on Tanaka.
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Anonymous2013-04-03 10:59
>>343
I've never heard of Tanaka's name being brought up, as far as I know, Saber vs Lancer was Nozomu Abe's work.
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Anonymous2013-04-03 11:09
>>338
Jun Arai is a joke of an animator, of course there is no love. He should forget the pretty drawings and go back to the basics of movement, cause it's obvious he never learned them.
>>345
Is Arasan is shitty, then why does he keep getting work?
Arasan: 1
Haters: 0
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Anonymous2013-04-03 11:24
>>349
Because the average viewer loves his pretty drawings, evidently. We all know the average viewer doesn't give a shit about the quality of the movement.
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Anonymous2013-04-03 11:26
>>350
You know the "average viewer" hates arasan as well as any other animator with a distinct style, so don't try to pull that bullshit.
Yep. Arasan is like instant noodles. Shit and unappetizing, but cheap and gets done in 5 minutes.
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Anonymous2013-04-03 11:35
>>355
>implying instant noodles can't be shit and appetizing
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Anonymous2013-04-03 11:44
>>351
I wonder. The average viewer notices pictures drawn with a lot of detail, and arasan is great at that. The average viewer also doesn't pay attention to the animation, so it's not a problem if arasan sucks at it.
Seriously, I can't believe anyone would think arasan gets work because studios thinks he's a good animator. If he didn't have his unique drawing style and all he had was his (pitiful) animation, no one would give a shit about him. No one.
Take all those MADs with a grain of salt. Anyone who claims they can identify this or that animator is most likely full of shit, unless that animator has a clearly distinguishable style like Ohira. Only trust official sources like genga books and the like, because a lot of animators are actually quite versatile and can adapt to the work , or they're just "your average animator" that is indistinguishable from anything. The identifiable animators are a very small minority. Neither Tanaka nor Abe have distinct enough animation styles, for a (relevant) example.
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Anonymous2013-04-03 12:53
Arasan gets work because the industry is tiny. Just to quote Cindy Yamauchi, you don't need to be a good artist to work on anime at all. So there, you have it.
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Anonymous2013-04-03 13:12
>>363
Yeah absolutely, he would still be able to work as an animator if he wanted to. But if it wasn't for his drawing style, how much recognition do you think he would get? If he didn't have his fancy drawing style, do you think we would still see his stuff in sakuga videos? Would people even talk about him at all?
In my opinion, no. His drawing style is really all he has going for him, and if it wasn't for that he would be just another of the many anonymous animators that work in the industry.
You're forgetting all those other animators that work in the industry and don't get MADs. The argument was initially that since Arasan gets work work he's good. Let's not shift the goalposts here. I was only replying to that argument.
As for Arasan having a "fanbase", well there's no shortage of people who are into things just to be into things, and people who like things because they're different.
I think Arasan is a talented animator, what he does is pretty unique and stands out, it's not everyone's cup of tea I can admit. But he wouldn't be able to do what he does if he didn't understand the basics. A good comparison is that youtube guy Otaking, he very much admires the similar kind of animation Arasan strives for, but Otaking is self taught and hasn't really studied the basics all that much so Otaking's attempts at that 80s style come off really awkward, on the other hand, Arasan is someone who has worked on his art and skill before breaking out with his animation style a few years ago (2008 ish?) before that he had worked in the industry for around 10 years. Heck he's a graduate of Studio Giants. Note the word "graduate" - he wouldn't have graduated if they didn't drill into him the basics of form, perspective and animation.
His drawing style is part of his animation, it is undoubtedly linked. Split the two and you're going to be singling out a lot of animators.
Though I don't see why people say he's not good at animation, take this scene: http://youtu.be/NU3aZHL1inQ?t=24s
From Zetta Karen Children, the movement of the bullet, the moving backgrounds, the changing camera perspective.
Even this Needless scene: http://youtu.be/NU3aZHL1inQ?t=2m55s
I can't honestly say this is bad animation given it's a scene where there is a moving camera going through a perspective extremely uncommon for TV anime.
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Anonymous2013-04-03 13:39
What's the deal with Arasan, calm down everyone. hahaha
>>363 "you don't need to be a good artist to work on anime at all."
That's true, but so is hollywood full of crappy people and any other industry.
Wherever you work, there will always be people like Arasan, and people like Okiura, but also people you have never heard of.
Arasan works on projects he can work on, so does Okiura or Ohira.
it doesn't matter, Arasan's fucked up timing is on purpose, he is too different and that's why some people hate him.
I think he is just trying to experiment the shit out of it.
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Anonymous2013-04-03 13:48
Arasan's timing isn't on purpose. He just sucks at animating. Do you have any examples where his stuff doesn't move like crap?
Those two cuts are bad animation. The same identical timing as everything he does. Hold, fast change, hold , HOOOOOLLDDD SOME MORE, change. It's like everything is moving in saccadelike ways whenever Arasan animates. Everything is jump-stop jump-stop jump-stop. It's repetitive as hell and it looks like shit.
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Anonymous2013-04-03 13:58
Ultimately, whether you like Arasan or not, he happens to be an important animator that well known artists rely on for key episodes and scenes. So hey, you might think that Kanada style is terrible, but don't even try to pull that he just gets around because it's cheap/anyone can work in anime.
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Anonymous2013-04-03 13:58
>>368
Oh, I'm sure his fucked up timing is on purpose. It still looks like a way to cover up the fact that he can't come up with movement that makes sense or works in any way. He tries to mimic a style of animation but doesn't really get it, and fails spectacularly at movement as a result.
Go watch some Yoshimichi Kameda if you want to see an example of that kind of animation style done right.
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Anonymous2013-04-03 14:01
>>371
You know whats funny, Kameda is a friend of Arasan, he drew a picture for him in one of Arasan's doujinshi.
>>370
Kanada style is not terrible at all, it's great in the hand of the right animators. Problem is, Arasan is not Kanada style. Arasan is "I really want to be a fancy animator but I don't get movement" style.
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Anonymous2013-04-03 14:10
>>374
Arasan draws with Masahito Yamashita's style. Go look up some of Yamashita's works on youtube, there are lots there. http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=%E5%B1%B1%E4%B8%8B+%E5%B0%86%E4%BB%81
Arasan isn't some chump people hire because they have no choice. He has the respect fellow animators and seniors that acknowledge his work.
Do you think half of the animators on Ippatsu Hicchuu!! Devander would have worked on that OVA if they didn't like/enjoy/despised Arasan or his timing? Do you think the following would have come to Arasan's first attempts at a project where he could flesh out his style?
Hideki Kakita
Jun Arai
Masahito Yamashita
Masami Obari
Ryuji Shiromae
Shin Matsuo
Shingo Fujii
Takashi Hashimoto
Takeshi Itou
Yoshimichi Kameda
Yoshitaka Kohno
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Anonymous2013-04-03 14:21
>>375
Still think the only reason he's respect/wanted on specific projects is his drawing style. His timing, his movement, his animation in general is laughable.
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Anonymous2013-04-03 14:59
always though this was animated by Koji Morimotoさん http://youtu.be/T2I5WKiIvf0?t=4m11s … Morimotoさん told me that it's done by Takashi Nakamura. great work！
via Bahi
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Anonymous2013-04-03 15:04
Arasan should just put shading on other people's drawings instead of doing animation himself. It's the only thing he's good at, but damn he's GOOD at it.
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Anonymous2013-04-03 15:11
>>369
"Do you have any examples where his stuff doesn't move like crap?"
yes here, when the punch suddenly stopps, it has Okiura quality. http://youtu.be/NU3aZHL1inQ?t=55s
it shows that arasan can also have a normal timing.
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Anonymous2013-04-03 15:19
>>377 who is Takashi Nakamura (is he related to Yutapon?), can't find any of his other animations, but seems like he is a sick animator. The background animation in that bike scene is like something Ohira would do now, but that scene was done back in the 80s when Ohira wasn't Ohira. This Nakamura guy must be the first Ohira.
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Anonymous2013-04-03 15:22
>>380 actually this brings me up to an interesting topic.
There are so many other interesting animators out there, but sadly we don't know much about them since their clips are not listed on sakuga wiki, nor on any sakuga MADs. I would like to see a Takashi Nakamura MAD.
Takashi Nakamura was character designer and animation supervisor on Akira. Says enough about his superior skills.
I think the reason why his animations are not well known is because his career is focused on him as a director and designer.
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Anonymous2013-04-03 15:32
>>380
Go to anipages and search for his name in the box, you are right in thinking Ohira was inspired by him.
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Anonymous2013-04-03 15:47
Anyone who has seen Dangaioh know who did this bit? http://youtu.be/IqpNdba7uEY?t=2m7s
The bit where it stands up from all the dust, it looks like its done on 1s...? It doesn't look Obari, maybe it's Takashi Hashimoto? http://youtu.be/IqpNdba7uEY?t=2m45s This bit looks more like Obari I think.
though I really recommend downloading a HD version of it
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Anonymous2013-04-04 8:42
When will KyoAni ever be on the same level of creativity as the folks on trigger....
Just finished Tamako and they're so inconsistent with OC.
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Anonymous2013-04-04 8:45
>>395
Trigger have only created two things so far. A silly low budget web short and LWA - which was funded to be a training project.
That new Imaishi show is probably where we will see the true power of Trigger.
That said, I wish KyoAni would break out of their comfort zone. I guess with Kyokai no Kanata they are trying that.
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Anonymous2013-04-04 8:58
New Naruto intro is amazing. Well done Yamashita.
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Anonymous2013-04-04 9:19
>>394
That's some pretty stylish stuff, reminded me of yama's solo ED he did for the show a while back combined with ep 167(but more on-model). I like it.
Come on, not this shit again please. Animation thread remember? Those things don't matter here. I personally hate the living shit out of Tengen Toppa Gurren Lagan (it's shit, fuck anyone who disagrees [insert joke here]) and I'm not too fond of Little Witch Academia, Panty & Stocking and whatever else Imaishi and company were involved in (except maybe Dead Leaves which was retarded, harmless fun) and I can't stand the westaboo vibes they have (thank god all their lot got quarantined in trigger and the gainax folk I like went to khara - I'm 100% honest here).
That being said I can still apreciate the animation which is, in itself, really fucking fantastic (which is why I even watched their stuff even though I do not like their stuff per se)! End of story. Live and let live.
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Anonymous2013-04-04 9:40
Holy shit yamashita. I love his style but this is really the best I've seen from him.
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Anonymous2013-04-04 9:50
>ryochimo will direct the new Yozakura Quartet TV series!!
So it's getting an OVA and a TV series? I'm glad the world didn't end in 2012.
Shingo Yamashita has is reaching the level of Mitsuo Iso.
I love this OP.
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Anonymous2013-04-04 10:41
>>406
Well lets not go that far, but he's certainly one of the best web-gen animators in the industry. Examples of digital animation like the latest Naruto OP or something a bit older like Iso's Rahxephon episode makes me wonder about the sort of unique visuals that digital animation can bring to the table. I hope to see more animators make good use if digital animation in the future.
I was referring to the animation. KyoAni never really gets to vent out any of their talent. Horiguchi was the only one to break from their usual style in that CM.
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Anonymous2013-04-04 11:16
KyoAni never really gets to vent out any of their talent.
Hiraifaces aside, anything good in Majestic Prince?
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Anonymous2013-04-04 11:46
>>411
I think he means that they generally try to limit the individuality in their animators' styles for the sake of greater conformity/consistency in their productions. I don't really have much of a problem with it myself, but I do understand why people would take issue with it, especially those in the 'sakuga' fandom where people enjoy being able to pick out animators they like and go "this cut was animated by such-and-such and this one by who's-it". Or maybe what >>413 said.
>>414
He'll make his glorious, long-awaited return in Photo Kano. Mark my words.
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Anonymous2013-04-04 11:47
>>414 you know, Iso is now 48 years old.
I think he had his time, and he had the best time.
The new animators will always remember him, and we will always remember him,
as Iso, the greatest animator ever lived.
Well not necessarily. But in a way you could say that.
Nichijou was really my favorite show from KyoAni. They got to toy around so much stuff that it was really almost like breaking the typical KyoAni feel. Hyouka had that at times but majority it was the usual. Only time that felt quite unique was the this. http://puu.sh/2tL4B
Imaishi shouldn't even be in that triplet, because his style is pretty consistent and moderate, not like Yuasa or Shinbo.
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Anonymous2013-04-04 13:03
Shinbo is overrated.
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Anonymous2013-04-04 13:07
Don't you mean Simbo
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Anonymous2013-04-04 13:07
>>426
YAMATO isn't in your list so we can't discuss
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Anonymous2013-04-04 13:31
Nah, Shinbo is just hit or miss. Ikuhara on the other hand is overrated as shit. Mamoru Hosoda > Kunihiko-chan.
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Anonymous2013-04-04 13:33
>>429
Depends on what you consider moderate. Dead Leaves was fucking wacky everywhere.
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Anonymous2013-04-04 13:37
Dead Leaves had a very consistent approach to its animation, settei, character desig, art direction etc. Compare that to Mind Game that goes to like a couple dozen animation techniques and styles.
>>441 you are right, the director of this project mentioned that he like the japanese animation technique. He was inspired by Ghibli.
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Anonymous2013-04-04 15:13
>>382
What anime he directed in 2012 and 2013?
I need more of his work
This dude is insane
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Anonymous2013-04-04 15:13
Takashi nakamura is the father of Yutapon?
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Anonymous2013-04-04 15:18
Nakamura really didn't direct much. His last work was Fantastic Children back in 2004.
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Anonymous2013-04-04 15:28
And he really didn't animate that much either, which is a shame.
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Anonymous2013-04-04 16:00
We always talk about animators animating, but which animators do you think make for the best ARTISTS? The Yoshinari brothers are the obvious stand-out and Kenichi Yoshida is also really solid.
They're all good animation wise. It's all about what's extra. Ryo has shitty art and colour direction (it looks like every anime ever) and Arve doesn't really have that many stand out cuts. After LWA, next you should watch it Death Billiards I guess. That's the second best one imo.
If you haven't seen the previous releases, check out Kizuna Ichigeki and Wasurenagumo. I guess Buta and Ojii-san no Lamp are worth it too if you have the time.
lots of Kim Se Jun stuff at the beginning, 'splosions, mecha etc
towards the 30 minute mark there are a bunch of fight scenes and I think some of them looked like Kameda (part where Stark gets the suit out of a suitcase or w/e)
and there are a bunch of itano circus cuts
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twinshiggy2013-04-04 22:05
I'm studying animation.
The two animated scenes I have found to be the most impressive are the opening scene of GitS;
Is my taste shit? That's okay.
I'm not naive enough to think I will become famous or make large amounts of money from this trade, but I would like to at least make something crazy good, which makes people look and say; 'How is it possible for someone to have done this?'
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Anonymous2013-04-04 22:09
I want to animate something from scratch so realistic people think it's rotoscoped.
Everyone loves GitS in the sakuga thread, but I think most people would rather mention the Iso tank and the (Okiura?) muscles ripping apart near the end rather than the OP.
Also: Oshii is shit for even agreeing to do the GitS 2.0 remake.
No nobody's surprise, MJP's CGI was nicely done and there were some well-animated cuts of hand-drawn explosions in the prologue. The Hiraifaces weren't too bad to look at since they were making all sorts of silly faces most of the time.
A bit disappointed with Photo Kano's animation, unremarkable stuff but there were some neat layouts thanks to Yokoyama.
Ans speaking of layouts, Maou-sama had quite a number of good ones. I'm quite pleased with this show, the prologue was nicely animated and I think there was some nice bits of character animation later in the episode.
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Anonymous2013-04-05 4:38
most people would rather mention the Iso tank
I don't know about most, but imo that's definitely the best scene in the film, animation wise. Of course, the opening sequence is fantastic as well.
Also, pretend 2.0 doesn't exist (even though there is some stuff behind it, making it more "consistent" visually with innocence, but yeah, it's crap). At least they didn't retcon the original.
Well, most things he was involved in have excellent animation. Not to mention that if you're into realistic animation he's the go to creator (when you think about this style of animation, as far as titles go the first to come to mind are Patlabor, Gits/Innocence) .
As a director and creator, he's one of my favourites. On my list only Takahata and Anno rank higher.
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Anonymous2013-04-05 4:59
>>450
I really like Ryotimo's illustration work as well as Shouko Nakamura's.
I also see Cindy H Yamauchi, Takaaki Waada, Eiji Komatsu, Shin Wakabayashi and Takenori Tsukuma
Can you post who did the AD, storyboards and direction?
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Anonymous2013-04-05 5:51
i can't moonstone, is that the obari thing in autumn?
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Anonymous2013-04-05 5:56
God I hate Hamasaki Hiroshi. What the hell does he find so interesting about bloom and that shitty gray filter? Every damn one of his titles suffer from this crap. Texhnolyze, Shigurui, Steins;Gate and now Technovore. Just, why... it just ruins the colours.
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Anonymous2013-04-05 5:59
New Obari robot anime, starting /TOMORROW/
2D Mecha.
Director: Obari
Mecha AD & Designs: Masahiro Yamane
Character Designs: Kotobuki Tsukasa
Looks to be a short anime, like many are these days.
>>486 Soichiro Matsuda worked in Majestic Prince #1 he did really nice explosions at the beginning
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Anonymous2013-04-05 9:10
>>514
Wow, so this is pretty much a "pile everyone on top and hope for the best" kind of work.
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Anonymous2013-04-05 9:19
I'm watching the Aku no Hana livestream now, this rotoscope is, uh, something I guess. The characters look pretty strange since they're just traced over actors, a bit of that uncanny valley kicking in. It's nice too see a lot of movement, but there's just something funny about the rotoscope. I'm not sure what to think of it.
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Anonymous2013-04-05 9:23
what is Space Dandy?
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Anonymous2013-04-05 9:29
>>518
Studio Bones new work this fall
Rumors say Shinchiro Watanabe is directing
Rumors say Dai Sato is scripting
Rumors say Thomas Roman is doing design/backgrounds
>>517
After thinking about it for a short while, basically it's great to see so much movement but god damn those characters look so awkward. It would've been better to use the live-action footage for just movement, and draw the character faces without tracing the actors faces.
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Anonymous2013-04-05 9:54
>>521
Dude , the blur is done to separate different plans
Like reality if you want
My main concern on this pic is the onion effect haha
Looks like a drunk view
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Anonymous2013-04-05 9:54
>>523
Yes, it was announced to fully utilise rotoscoping a while back.
>>525
I agree. The faces were definitely the biggest flaw in it for me. If they'd done that, kept the art closer to the manga, but with a more realistic touch to it so it wasn't just flat faces on realistic bodies, I doubt people would have as many complaints. It might still look weird, but not as flagrantly.
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Anonymous2013-04-05 11:16
Is rotoscoping more expensive than animating traditionally?
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Anonymous2013-04-05 11:20
I feel there's going to be a backlash against the Aku no Hana complaints by people claiming it's getting hate just because the visuals are different, when that's not true at all. Sure, your average fan will cry about it not being ANIME enough but it's got some genuine issues I don't think you should overlook.
Many people have mentioned this thing about the faces lacking all features if they're far enough (read as: not very far, really) from the camera due to, I'm assuming, the filters on the footage. The funny thing being that if they move towards you, eyes, mouth and nose will gradually appear. Now if this was uncommon I wouldn't mind, but it keeps happening throughout and it's as distracting as you'd imagine.
There's also a recurring issue with rotoscoped pieces, and realistic animation in general, which is the acting being too exaggerated. As an animation fan I obviously don't hate motion, but this case is bad enough to become jarring. It feels like a problem with the base footage, it's kinda over the top and it doesn't feel natural even though the aim of the series appears to be extreme realism. Your mileage may vary greatly here though, I can't deny that it's nice seeing an anime with characters acting for real.
Add more factors like the clash between characters and backgrounds or the apparent lack of an animated opening and you get an overall package that will feel more cheap or atmospheric depending on who judges it. Nagahama's managed to make a creepy manga feel even more eerie, but there's plenty of reasons to question his artistic choices (and things that people will justify as such, when they're just cheap shortcuts).
I wouldn't say Aku no Hana is bad because it's different. It's different, and also bad.
I think the issue is Japanese acting in general is very over-acted and hammy. So if they use footage like that as a basis, then of course the animation is also going to look over-acted. It's a valid issue, but something that can't really be avoided.
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Anonymous2013-04-05 11:34
is it wrong if I like to pretend that the show is not rotoscoped?
no, Disney used rotoscoping for Cinderella because it was cheaper than traditional animation
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Anonymous2013-04-05 11:37
>>544
Sure, just imagine the whole of Aku no Hana is a solo animation by an Okiura on drugs.
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Anonymous2013-04-05 11:40
>>543
Yeah, that doesn't help. It's like they're having weird spams rather than acting like normal people, and that backfires really hard because the whole thing is meant to look realistic.
I always find Dennou Coil's case funny but kinda sad. It was for kids and serious people but its main audience turned out to be pedos and doujin artists. LOL.
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Anonymous2013-04-05 12:32
Looking at the aku no hana credits, they have an entire live action team, tons of actors were used it seems.
Which begs the question, why not make it LA in the first place?
>>562
>I don't use rotoscope, it's not my thing.
>But I have nothing against animators that do.
pls stop misreporting
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Anonymous2013-04-05 14:06
>>562 >>563
I have a feeling that Bahi has some friends that rotoscope, so by adding the second sentence, he was trying to not offend his friends or whoever is rotoscoping.
He dislikes rotoscope, but he is ok with rotoscopers. so confusing wtf
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Anonymous2013-04-05 14:08
who are the animators of Aku no Hana?
Any professionals in the sakuga list?
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Anonymous2013-04-05 14:11
wow I just watched the OP of Aku No Hana. I have no idea what I actually watched.
>>484
Yeah, I found it pretty amazing they kept her hair consistent.
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Anonymous2013-04-05 15:48
Who are the best character designers according to the sakuga thread? My favorites are Yoshihiko Umakoshi, Kenichi Yoshida, Yoh Yoshinari and Nishiya Futoshi. Honorable mentions: Sadamoto, Goripon, Nishio.
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Anonymous2013-04-05 15:52
Are any of you animators or animate occasionally?
Is Flash alright to animate on or should I get something more professional?
but as soon as it starts moving everything looks like shit.
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Anonymous2013-04-05 17:32
>>582
Hmm, I like it.
Story's shit, but the art and animation is good.
Setting is Japan, so everyone has black hair.
Some people are ugly. Good.
Rotoscoping is annoying but considering they might not have been able to keep a consistent level of animation, perhaps it is needed.
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Anonymous2013-04-05 17:35
anyone knows the reason why they decided to rotoscope that show?
I mean, this show doesn't even look like the manga.
What's the purpose of all this??
Is there something artsy behind it? or money? or my asshole?
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Anonymous2013-04-05 17:36
worst thing about the show is that as soon as characters are in distant their faces disappear.
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Anonymous2013-04-05 17:38
the last two months have actually been awesome sakuga months.
I need to rewatch Witch Academia and forgett all the terrible rotoscope.
>>591
Well, I do animate traditionally in college,
I don't have that set up at home.
Do you use a camera on a tripod to shoot it?
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Anonymous2013-04-05 18:08
>>576
Personally I didn't have a problem with it, I thought it looked nice.
Except for the face details gradually appearing as people came closer to the camera, that was an awful choice. It looked like something out of an old videogame with rendering problems.
>>607
Better than Love Live. Sunrise, are you even trying?
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Anonymous2013-04-06 4:22
but muh rotoscope
Well, not unexpectedly looks like I'll even have to abandon this thread, not just /a/ while Aku no Hana airs. (Not that anyone cares though). Enjoy your lame bandwagoning over nothing. I'm sure I will not be missed.
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Anonymous2013-04-06 4:28
>>610
Before you leave, I'd like to know what do you think of it?
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Anonymous2013-04-06 5:05
>>607
Oh my god haha. A few odd cuts that have almost impossible movements given their speed, the hip thrusts and the arm flick were going at sonic speed!
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Anonymous2013-04-06 6:42
Hmm, Aku no Hana was great. And I do mean, _great_. I kinda see where everyone is coming from complaining about the animation, but then again I really do not and I only lied to be diplomatic. Sorry.
I don't know, I don't think there's anything wrong with bagging on the creative decisions regarding animation (and it's hip to hate rotoscoping nowadays, as far as I've observed) since this is the animation "appreciation" thread. But the complaints come of as superficial as a consequence. Superficial because they're removing things from context, kinda like those cherry picked bad looking frames that are spammed all over /a/ now (I kinda had to shove my head in there and peekk after what 610 posted - I was not "disappointed"). What this is from my POV? Pretty much the reverse of the "classic" Pain fight, or more recently Jun Arai's cuts in Shinsekai Yori which also had people complaining about them (or maybe even some of the stuff in Sacred Star of Milos? since that was brought up some time ago), i.e. it's about confusing craft with art. Those are good craft, but poor creative decisions. This is shit craft, but a fantastic creative decision on the director's part.
Why? Precisely because it's creepy, unsettling, "wrong" to look at. That's exactly what it should look like, because that's what the narrative is supposed to convey. Unease, oppression. Forget about the animation and think about (excuse me going over the line here) the soundscape and music. Same feeling isn't it? Very down, low key. And since I went this much beyond my station, think a little about the MC, and how his perspective is being shown, especially his mood as it comes through the monologues (let's ignore visual elements just for a blink, for the sake of argument). Pretty much in the same ballpark isn't it? Or am I wrong? I'd like to think I'm not. Watching Aku no Hana should make you feel disconcerted, that's what I think. I may be wrong and maybe the director (and production team as a whole) went for something else entirely, but that is what it seems to me to be trying to convey, looked both in detail and as a whole. And I think it does it really well. (it also reminds me of the "Fuyu no Hi" anthology, which also had some pretty shitty segments, craft-wise, but they also fit in due to the nature of the overall work).
Also, the fact that rotoscoping really is saving something (be that the purpose all along, or just a consequence of these decision, and be it only cash or time as well) makes other visual components in the work (or at least in this first episode, so far) shine. The layouts are quite above the norm. It's harder to find cuts that don't have a neat composition than cuts that do. I dare say that if anyone claims the contrary, they're full of shit. Just open it and screen randomly, it's pretty likely you'll find a cut with pleasant arrangements in the image. So is the storyboarding. A nice standout scene happens about half way in, where the 3 guys go home and the whole thing is set up so that you'll only see them reflected in that pole mirror in the last part of the scene. That would be what I'd call interesting storyboarding. But you can say you care about the animation, not its framing and "cinematography". Fine.
Really, this kinda smells of double standard. It all boils down to whether you care about the craft of animation, or the art of animation. Because shitty craft is shitty craft, but shitty craft can make for good art. And with this I guess I'll take 610s lead and see myself out because I obviously do not belong here...
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Anonymous2013-04-06 6:56
>>571
My favourite characters designers would be Ryotimo and Futoshi Nishiya, they're both great. I also like Yuichi Tanaka and Shouko Nakamura, but the specific qualities I like about Tanaka's artwork don't tend to survive the animation process and Nakamura's barely done any chara design work.
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Anonymous2013-04-06 7:20
>>613
Please do stick along because I'd rather read detailed views on your beliefs of the subject rather than meme spamming and "it looks ugly therefore it is bad"
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Anonymous2013-04-06 8:14
who is excited for the next sakugas videos.??
It's full of already win
Majestic prince
Shingeki no Kyojin (those battles sounds crazy as fuck)
LWA (dat ending actions with the dragon , yoshinari the king)
Yozakura Quartet: Hana no Uta (Ryo...)
Arise (hell yeah)
Shortooo peace (Otomo)
Aku No Hana (i'm joking)
Winning is comin
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Anonymous2013-04-06 8:29
>>613
Stop looking down on everyone but you and assuming that you're the only one here that knows what art direction is and has realized the ABSOLUTELY OBVIOUS AIM they had with this. I mean, you can keep congratulating yourself for having realized it, but when there's even a translated interview where they talk about it then you're going to look a little silly.
Yes, Nagahama achieved a very eerie atmosphere is just one episode. Not necessarily in the same vein as the manga - or rather, not at all, to the point that the mangaka said he considers this a different take on his story. But he added that the director truly understands it so he trusts him to make a good Aku no Hana anime. That's great. But it doesn't change how very poorly made it is. You can claim that the terrible acting adds to the creepy vibe they were going for, but don't even try to say that there's anything intentional or positive about crap like the faces popping up and disappearing. And say that crying about that is the same as /a/ posting inbetweens all you want, but it won't stop being utter bullshit. Something that is part of a whole being nitpicked and a recurring issue that adds absolutely nothing to the episode aren't the same by any stretch.
You should know full well that anyone who's complained here wasn't upset by the artistic intent but rather by how shitty the production is. If it doesn't bother you, or anyone else for that matter, I honestly don't care. Just stop pulling this act of misunderstood genius and creating random drama.
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Anonymous2013-04-06 8:43
By the way , question to other pro animators here
Will you work for a producer wich always push back the date of payment and always give BS excuse to not pay you ?
what do you do, you stay and stay patient or leave asap ?
Different guy here but maybe you should take the chill pill. I didn't know about that interview you mentioned btw. Stop assuming everyone did. Maybe that other poster did not know too.
Oh and I forgot to say. I still thought it is "creepy" even without that interview. So I don't get your point. "Terrible acting", i'm afraid I do not see it like that. The face popping things was kinda annoying, I guve you that. But it so minor thats a nitpick.
Not really my thing tho.
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Anonymous2013-04-06 8:57
>>620
Of course you realized the eeriness, it's really blatant. All I said was that it's been confirmed that the creepy feel is intentional, the interview itself is besides the point.
The problem is simple: it's not "pretty" enough for the average viewer, "sakuga" lover or not. That it's not supposed to look pretty in the first place doesn't matter.
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Anonymous2013-04-06 9:11
Anyone who thinks the acting in Aku no Hana is bad should probably watch less anime. It was up to standard with your average dorama.
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Anonymous2013-04-06 9:26
While it isn't exactly sakuga, what do you kids think of Perfect Blue?
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Anonymous2013-04-06 9:27
>>624
And anyone who thinks the acting in your average dorama is decent should watch more movies.
>>13
Yeah, they've been animating for a year now. And they would need to break their no S3 rule in order to beat the Oreimo+Railgun steamroller that is this season.
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Anonymous2013-04-06 10:33
I kind of warmed up to AnH a bit after rewatching, but the lack of detail or shading for the characters really leaves them looking flat and the exaggerated acting doesn't really help. I only hope that the results they get with rotoscoping get better as the show goes on.
The episode also would have probably worked better if the first fifteen minutes weren't entirely anime original. Then again, Nagahama did say that he did not want a straight adaptation of the manga.
Off-topic but this is the kind of adaptation that I prefer. What's the point of adapting anything if you're just going to follow it closely? What works in manga does not necessarily work in a TV anime.
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Anonymous2013-04-06 10:46
I'm having a weird sense of deja-vu with this whole Aku no Hana thing...
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Anonymous2013-04-06 10:53
>>632
It really depends on the source material I think.
If it's a manga where the focus is entirely on the characters rather than any sort of story then a straight adaptation works well because the whole point is just to see the characters animated and voiced.
Whereas something with a big focus on the story there's less reason to straight adapt it because it adds less.
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Anonymous2013-04-06 11:14
Just saw Death Billiards. It's so much better than Little Witch Academia. IN pretty much every aspect.
>>635
It's better from all aspects except the animation.
But Death Billiards also has great animation climax scenes.
Little Witch Academia has a more dynamic action scenes than Death Billiards.
Little Witch Academia is better written; the characters are more natural and less transparent. The direction is also movie-like; Death Billiards feels like an important episode of a TV series, LWA feels like a movie. There is really no point of comparison. It's actually ridiculous to even compare them. It's like the dumb people that actually compare the Digimon movie to Summer Wars; sure, the Digimon movie was good, but the direction in Summer Wars was more mature and accomplished.
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Anonymous2013-04-06 12:05
just so madhouse fanboys know, the entire story of death billiards was completely copypasted from a twilight zone episode; even more so than lwa from the worst witch/harry potter
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Anonymous2013-04-06 12:06
>>450
I really love Tatsuyuki Tanaka's works. Cannabis Works is one of the best artbooks by animator I've ever seen.
Why did you even feel the need to post hyperboly to make a point. This thread really doesn't need more passive-aggressive shit. What is even everything? Character design? LWA designs had more character, they were more unique, they had easily identifiable silhouettes; Death Billiard had pleasant art but the designs were pretty standard anime fare (complete with white haired bishounen). Backgrounds? LWA's varied, detailed, hand-drawn backgrounds aren't even comparable to Death Billiard's nice-looking but repetitive and modernly CG-filled backgrounds alive. Art direction? The amount of colors used in LWA is insane; it looks more polished than most anime movies. Writing? Death Billiards tried to be more "clever" but it kinda fell flat on its face near the end with almost every single line of dialogue being redundant and overly expository; LWA was more elegant in its execution, with no superfluous elements and ultimately making every single element of the story worth something.
Death Billiards is good, but there really is no need to sell it by comparing it to a completely different short film, specially in such a "poking the bear" type of way.
>>635
Is it really? I haven't watched LWA yet, but I saw the first half of Death Billiards and I wasn't impressed with the animation at all (not to mention the ugly, run-of-the-mill character designs).
In case you're not talking about the animation, can you even compare the two? Genres look too different to me.
I can imagine it now, cursing and swearing as he has to draw "fucking moeshit" and occasionally shouting "I WON AN AWARD ONCE, I USED TO BE SOMEONE!!!"
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Anonymous2013-04-06 13:15
What the hell? I was just saying that Death Billiards was fantastic, not that LWA sucks dammit. LWA was awesome. Holly shit dudes, you need to calm the fuck down.
muh yoshinari muh trigger
What was so special about Little Witch Academia that you have to get so riled up over such a simple thing? Yes, the animation in Death Billiards was better too. That single scene with the wires at the end was better than anything in LWA. The motion is more detailed in Death Billiards (okay, admittedly this is a stylistic choice since LWA is more cartoony and Death Billiards more realistic - but still, I'd say that takes more effort, again just putting that out there). The art direction was better (LWA wasn't that impressive from this perspective to be honest), the storyboarding was better by a fucking LANDSLIDE with a lot of cool stuff like the cool zooms and various other cinematographic (is that the right word?) tricks that add an extra bit of panache to the visuals. It also played with layers in more interesting ways. LWA was very flat by comparison. It also liked the background animation in Death Billiards more (with the kid walking down the street) since it didn't rely on fucking cycles like in LWA (not that there's anything wrong with that of course, just putting that out there).
Overall, as fun as LWA was, Death Billiards was simply better technically.
but muh cartoony acting and designs
That's just a style. Death Billiards had character acting too and it was great. And the designs were all different, expressive and easily distinguishable. Sure, there are only 4 character so there's that as an excuse to put more effort into them but the point stands.
And no, I was talking about "everything" animation (aren't we in the sakuga thread?), not also about story/writing, characters, soundtrack whatever. If I were to take that stuff into consideration as well, I liked LWA a lot more. Difference between an 8/10 for LWA and a 6/10 for Death Billiards. So calm the fuck down.
The amount of colors used in LWA is insane; it looks more polished than most anime movies.
Bull fucking shit.
Death Billiard had pleasant art but the designs were pretty standard anime fare
Ha, so this is who I am conversing with. How typical.
That's a non-argument and a moot point. You're like those retards who claim all KyoAni characters look like keions.
Dude, I'm pretty much the first guy (and only, as far as I observe) who talked about Death Billiards and Im no madhouse fanboy. I'm no studio's fanboy. I just like cool animation regardless who does it. Nice knee jerk of ya'll, seriously. If anything, there's a whole lotta yoshinari/imaishi/trigger faboys in here.
that whole fight was great. almost every cut was golden.
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Anonymous2013-04-06 13:27
>>658
The fight was great, but the specific cuts post posted were pretty meh.
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Anonymous2013-04-06 13:31
I saw the first half of Death Billiards and I wasn't impressed with the animation at all
The animation was great. If you were not impressed by it you won't be impressed with LWA either, because apparently you're not impressed with good animation in general.
(not to mention the ugly, run-of-the-mill character designs).
There's your problem. /facepalm
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Anonymous2013-04-06 13:33
so madhouse crushed down trigger?
can't believe it , they are back from ashes
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Anonymous2013-04-06 13:34
Nobody crushed anyone. stop trying to start a studio war. trigger's still a ababy anyway.
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Anonymous2013-04-06 13:35
>>652
>It's so much better than Little Witch Academia. IN pretty much every aspect.
death billiards sakuga fight made me laugh so hard.
It had nice animation but not great animation, whoever storyboarded this fight scene thought this show was a joke to him.
seriously, I can grab a lot more decent sakuga from DB, there is a lot more
All the choreography was based on "Cowboy Bebop The Movie" fight scenes-
check out the background sakuga here, it's been over 10 years since I saw background sakuga. If DB had moving BG, they would just have moved one frame of BG and added some motion blur to it, but LWA fucking kills it. http://i.minus.com/iXQXI8JpepsOM.gif
Trigger is not a baby, Trigger is fucking boss!
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Anonymous2013-04-06 13:47
>>652
>That single scene with the wires at the end was better than anything in LWA.
The dancing at the beginning, all the running in LWA, the creature animation, the acid poison... all better.
>The motion is more detailed in Death Billiards (okay, admittedly this is a stylistic choice since LWA is more cartoony and Death Billiards more realistic - but still, I'd say that takes more effort, again just putting that out there).
Rewatch LWA. The motion in LWA is by far more detailed than the motion in Death Billiards: you hace characters randomly playing with their hands, characters looking around IN THE BACKGROUND while other characters do other things in the forefront, you have consistent LIP-SYNCH, you have crowds reacing in uniquely different ways to events. And the running near the end of LWA was realistic; even with the cartoony designs, LWA created a living world through animation alone.
>The art direction was better (LWA wasn't that impressive from this perspective to be honest)
The hand-drawn backgrounds by Studio Pablo were gorgeous.
>the storyboarding was better by a fucking LANDSLIDE with a lot of cool stuff like the cool zooms and various other cinematographic (is that the right word?) tricks that add an extra bit of panache to the visuals.
Those zooms don't make the direction or storyboarding better. It doesn't even make visuals more interesting. I's flat out ridiculous to say "more tricks = better storyboard". Mamoru Hosoda doesn't use tricks. Isao Takahata doesn't use tricks. Oshii doesn't use tricks. Elegance > tricks.
>It also played with layers in more interesting ways.
No way. LWA had clever composition for CROWD scenes; it created crowd scenes filled with individuals moving and doing their own things without taking away focus from the main characters. The skill necessary to make CROWD SCENES is insane; there are even quotes from Anno and Imaishi calling it the hardest type of scene.
>LWA was very flat by comparison.
What the hell?
>It also liked the background animation in Death Billiards more (with the kid walking down the street) since it didn't rely on fucking cycles like in LWA (not that there's anything wrong with that of course, just putting that out there).
Akko sliding down the dragon was background animation and it wasn't a cycle.
>That's just a style. Death Billiards had character acting too and it was great. And the designs were all different, expressive and easily distinguishable. Sure, there are only 4 character so there's that as an excuse to put more effort into them but the point stands.
There was not more effort put into Death Billiards character designs or character acting.
I liked both LWA and Death Billiards and won't even compare them because they both deserve as much love as they can get. Let's talk about Muromi instead because it was awesome. Just watch the OP (starts at 00:40)
Then it was a poor stylistic choice since it didn't look good.
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Anonymous2013-04-06 13:57
>>691
This thread is always full of ex-Gainaxkids and Kyoanus lickers.
Real animation fans use twitter.
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Anonymous2013-04-06 13:58
I think this guy is just a troll, we all know that Yoh Yoshinari is one of the greatest.
Who the fuck was even the animation supervisor of Death Billiards?
Everyone who thinks that Death Billiards animation was better than Little Witch Academia is fucked up or just a troll.
Jesus Christ stop arguing like fucking whiny fucks with opinions flailing over the place. This is not /a/. Go to /a/ if you want to throw shit at one another.
I get the feeling that there are not more than 3 guys in this thread and that right now there are just 2 guys trolling each other, both thinking "JOKES ON HIM, I WAS JUST PRETENDING TO BE RETARDED".
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Anonymous2013-04-06 14:02
I think this guy is just a troll, we all know that Yoh Yoshinari is one of the greatest.
Stop clinging to names, that's just a fallacy. I know full well who Yoshinari is and I like his style (although I'm growing bored of his explosions). It don't matter who did what as long as it looks good.
Everyone who thinks that Death Billiards animation was better than Little Witch Academia is fucked up or just a troll.
Nah, they're there too. A lot of these new sakuga fans came in with TTGL and stuff, so it's explainable.
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Anonymous2013-04-06 14:02
While we are on the completely stupid comparisons...
Ghost in the Shell > TokiKake
Chihiro > Redline
End of Evangelion > Cowboy Bebop movie
K-ON > Mononoke
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Anonymous2013-04-06 14:03
Death Billiards had a very weak key-animation staff except Aya Suzuki.
all the others are only in-betweeners that just started their genga career with this show.
That why the animation in DB has zero Mitsuo Iso, because it's all about pose to pose, no dynamics or full genga.
Full genga are animators like Iso, Yutapon, Inoue, Sushio, Yoshinari.
They draw both keys and in-betweens.
Death Billiards had zero full genga feel to it. Everything was just put as a slow-mo, with only 3 main drawings.
But the frames in LWA all played a big role in the motion.
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Anonymous2013-04-06 14:04
Is it me or do some posts read like a Japanese Sakuga fan using Google Translate on his posts?
If you are talking about the guy who talked early about Aku no Hana after that long text, I'm just not good at english. But I don't translate with google.
>>704
Rapparu did a solo key-animation on an opening back in 2012.
Don't know the name of the show.
Talking about Bahi, he was asked to participate on both Death Billiards and Little Witch Academia. The production team though that he lived in Japan.
He couldn't participate at the end since Animemirai's whole point was to gather young animators together at one place.
Just dropping by to remember you guys that Evangelion is the best anime of all time.
So long!
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Anonymous2013-04-06 14:20
>>722 I knew it! Bahi is really an AI, or a ghost, maybe he doesn't exist at all and some japanese animator is using him as an alter ego.
Jokes beside,
if I was him I would be in Tokyo the next day, that would have been a great opportunity for him. Why is he still working through the net?!
Goddamnit Bahi JD, just fly to japan, what are you waiting for?!?!
Stop thinking you're any better than /a/. more than half of us came from /a/ and still post on /a/ almost daily. I'm getting fed up with your "holier than thou" attitude. These past few posts prove it. The whole internet is shit.
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Anonymous2013-04-06 14:24
>>725
yes, but the tweets don't exist anymore...........
He tweeted pretty long time ago.
Back then I didn't knew about his "I'm going to delete tweets for reasons" reputation
bahi is better than miyazaki, inoue and iso reunited
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Anonymous2013-04-06 14:32
>>730
He worked with Watanabe, he worked with Inoue, he is working for 4°c, he is working with Bones, he is working with Koji Morimoto, he is working with Satoru Utsunomiya
BUT
he still can't manage it to fly to Japan, wich is probably the easiest thing to do in the to do list.
He really is an AI or an alter ego of someone else in Japan.
Since Bahi is around, Iso has disappeared.
Bahi managed to work on a project with Toshiyuki Inoue (wtf, and he was the character designer wtf) and Inoue is Iso's best friend.
creepy
>>739
Quite possible that he actually is in Japan. This one sounds more believable.
You just can't do so much through the fucking internet.
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Anonymous2013-04-06 14:45
that kameda scene in the iron man movie is so unimpressive
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Anonymous2013-04-06 14:47
>>741
Really, from the clib someone uploaded I thought it was okay.
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Anonymous2013-04-06 14:49
>>737
When you type Mitsuo Iso in google images, Bahi JD's avatar appears somewhere.
>>763
No Aninari there, he just showed up in the first WA because it was at Seven Arcs. He isn't even involved with the original games so I doubt he'll be there.
I checked sakugawiki and apparently he worked on nearly every episode of the previous series. Has anyone seen it?
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Anonymous2013-04-06 22:36
>>767
I have. He did some short cuts in pretty much every episode, they're nice but not enough to justify watching the series for that. The production values aren't low either but it's not a sakuga anime by any stretch of the imagination. You know how slow Aninari is, so you can guess how short his cuts are considering he showed up in so many episodes.
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Anonymous2013-04-06 22:43
>>757
Neat, can't wait to be able to watch it. Hope every episode is a treat of web-kei goodness.
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Anonymous2013-04-06 22:43
when for a new macross in 2d with itano/miraki circus ?
and special effect from Anno ?
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Anonymous2013-04-06 22:52
>>770
If you want to see some recent animation from Anno, I think he did some work in Rebuild?
You think? All I see is standard, unimpressive animation.
We must have different definitions of sakuga :P
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Anonymous2013-04-07 0:15
>>774
It's pretty stylish stuff, and did you not see the cool background animation as well?
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Anonymous2013-04-07 0:22
>>775
The animation is not bad by any means, it's actually pretty polished, but it doesn't look like something to write home about either. The movement looks really generic to me.
>>777
Well, basically it's the kind of movement that you can see in every other anime ever. Basic anime stuff that doesn't look bad, but doesn't look impressive either. It's not the kind of movement that is so good or so unique that it leaves an impression on you and makes you wonder who did that part. It's not Shingo Yamashita, or Yutaka Nakamura, or Hironori Tanaka, or Yoshimichi Kameda, to make a few examples. It's a really generic kind of animation that looks fine and dandy, but doesn't make you want to watch it a second time.
That's my impression, at any rate.
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Anonymous2013-04-07 0:59
>>778
So it's the timing of the animation that you don't find to be impressive? How would you describe "generic" movement, I'm not to clear on that point of yours.
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Anonymous2013-04-07 1:05
>>779
"basically it's the kind of movement that you can see in every other anime ever."
This is how I would describe it. Go watch a moderately well animated episode from an average series that doesn't feature big names and you'll get what I mean.
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Anonymous2013-04-07 1:49
>>776 it's actually pretty polished
C'mon. It's not polished at all.
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Anonymous2013-04-07 2:08
Web-kei animators learned by copying. This is probably why their animation looks kinda generic sometimes.
It's not the kind of movement that is so good or so unique that it leaves an impression on you and makes you wonder who did that part. It's not Shingo Yamashita, or Yutaka Nakamura, or Hironori Tanaka, or Yoshimichi Kameda, to make a few examples.
I really hate this part of sakuga-fandom.
There are tons of good animation out there that never got discussed because "it's not different enough" or "We can't name who did it". Good animators who aim to create animation that fits well with the style of the anime was never appreciated enough.
Well, I guess sakugafags don't really care much about animation itself but they're just a bunch of fanboys of animators.
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Anonymous2013-04-07 2:55
>>782
The point is not being different enough. The point is being good enough to stand out. If it's not good enough to stand out in some way, then it's not "sakuga", it's just animation.
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Anonymous2013-04-07 3:01
>>782
"Web-kei animators learned by copying. This is probably why their animation looks kinda generic sometimes."
Or maybe there are simply good web animators and bad web animators, just like with traditional animators.
Good animators are good enough to come up with their own style, mediocre animators don't and that's why their work look generic.
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Anonymous2013-04-07 3:28
>>783 If it's not good enough to stand out in some way, then it's not "sakuga", it's just animation
Maybe we should change the name of these threads back to Sakuga thread after all
>Good animators are good enough to come up with their own style
Sometime good animator just
Do you think that Disney animators were not bad because they all animated in the same style too?
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Anonymous2013-04-07 3:36
Well, guess what: japanese animation is pretty different from Disney.
I think it's better to discuss sakuga on an imageboard.
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Anonymous2013-04-07 3:43
>>786 japanese animation is pretty different from Disney
And?
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Anonymous2013-04-07 3:48
The americans never mastered 2D animation, Milt Kahl was the only guy at disney who was on the same level as Inoue but now, Inoue already broke Milt's limit.
The japanese mastered 2D animation with Akira, Ghost in the Shell, Iso, Ohira, Okiura.
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Anonymous2013-04-07 3:54
>>788
And the average anime animation is pretty crappy compared to Disney's. Disney's stuff is always highly polished, the average japanese animation is not. Disney stuff may look great even if nothing stands out, but that's not the case with your average anime. In mass produced anime, the stuff that looks good IS the one that stands out. A mix of bad and good animators work on those series, and the animators that are truly good WILL end up standing out.
I don't believe Disney production work like that at all. You can't compare Disney to mass produced TV anime to make a point.
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Anonymous2013-04-07 4:01
>>790 and the animators that are truly good WILL end up standing out
We didn't even know who Takafumi Hori was until Redline sakuga MAD was made.
And we have someone like Arasan...
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Anonymous2013-04-07 4:07
Takafumi Hori is an animator.
Arasan is sakugaman.
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Anonymous2013-04-07 4:07
>>791
I remember the Takafumi Hori scenes in Shippuden #26 standing out for their quality. We may have not know the name of the animator back then, doesn't mean his skill isn't noticeable.
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Anonymous2013-04-07 7:03
9 old men>>> Iso, Ohira, Okiura, etc
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Anonymous2013-04-07 7:13
>>794
If they are so good, why don't they have any sakuga mad?
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Anonymous2013-04-07 7:13
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Ok guys, this thread is full of retards again.
Again we have pointless discussions about this nigger is better than that nigger and americans or japanese are the best. Go have a life you fucks!
Call me back when all the retarded fuckers are gone.
Eat shit fucker. Bahi is nowhere near as good as Miyazaki as an animator. Let's not even bring directorial skills into the picture because that'd make you look bat shit stupid.
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Anonymous2013-04-07 8:46
Look western fanboys, we all know that disney had great traditional animators (back then) but as years go by people who kept working on these stuff develop.
I'm pretty sure, if Milt Kahl was still alive and active, he would be as good as Inoue.
But sadly he passed away, and Inoue and Co. followed his path and developed 2D animation into the next level.
Inoue, Yutapon, Iso, Honda, they are all the followers, we the sakuga fans don't say the old disney animators are worst, they helped these new animators to develop into the next. Everyone is part of it.
So now, please let's have peace and stop hating.
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Anonymous2013-04-07 8:47
>>799
calm down, I think that was just a joke.
No one is as good as Miyazaki (yet), not even Miyazaki's son.
And you can't even compare young Bahi JD with the young versions of Inoue, Iso or Miyazaki. Because it's normal that younger people these days are more developed than the younger people 30 years ago.
The people Miyazaki looked up to back then were less skilled than the people Bahi is looking up to now.
Hironori Tanaka is shit. Gimmick animator that peaked in Precure.
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Anonymous2013-04-07 10:36
If you can replicate Ohira's animation digitally, then digital animators have no disadvantages compared to traditional animators. http://boqbo.tumblr.com/post/45368195132
everything is possible if you have the skills.
New generation animators are going to own it soon.
>>835
Smart ass, do you know what sakuga means?
It means animation.
I bet you watch animation every fucking day, so shut the fuck up with your sakuga is shit you failed at trolling. Go get a job, go study, go have a girlfriend, whatever you are going to fucking die, dont waste your time here.
>>839
You do realise, of course, that by replying to him, especially in such an agressive and vitriolic manner, you are doing exactly what he wants and essentially rewarding his behavior, right?
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Anonymous2013-04-07 18:13
>>815 >>828
Tanken Driland - 1000-nen no Maho - #1
Takahiro Watanabe, Hiroki Morimune, Yuuki Hayashi, Hisashi Mori
I think naotoshi shida is one of those guys that once you've seen a scene made by him, you've seen eveything he has to offer
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Anonymous2013-04-07 21:24
First episode sakuga reviews:
Muromi-san: snappy animation with good acting (interesting timing and good expressions) and some nice effects used for comedic effects
Titan: some good character animation scattered around a bunch of stills; that one cut of the bullies was good
Azazel-san Z: disappointing after S1 being consistently good-looking, it didn't have any particular stand-out cut
Majestic Prince: nope.jpg
Photo Kano: eh
Aku no Hana: controversial, at least
Demon King: first scene was good
Gargantia: fucking awful CG in the first half; cool running in the second half
why would you delude yourself thinking that rotoscoping is animation?
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Anonymous2013-04-07 22:51
why would you delude yourself thinking that rotoscoping is animation?
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Anonymous2013-04-07 23:23
Considering the treatment Bahi gets in /a/'s animation threads, and by trolls here, I found his comment pretty ironic.
But whatever, no need to make broad categorizations like that. Rotoscoping can look very good if done well (i.e. not Aku no Hana), and whether or not the artist feels like a machine is up to them, not up to whoever thought rotoscope was inherently inferior than animating from scratch.
I still prefer animating from scratch over rotoscope, by FAR.
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Anonymous2013-04-07 23:48
>>860
It's a technique used to created animation.
The definition of animation is really broad. In the early day, a series of live-action images was considered also animation.
Gargantia's CGI sadly wasn't that good, movement was a bit too jerky. I found the action in the first half hard to follow at times perhaps due to the over-abundance of laser beams. Pleasant character animation in the second half and I look forward to seeing Kameda's work later on in the series.
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Anonymous2013-04-08 5:29
>>862
I think he was only talking about the animators point of view.
Not if rotoscope looks good or bad. He didn't say that the rendering looks bad.
Of course it can look nice if you do a beautiful handmade rendering like "a Scanner Darkly".
But the artist doing that is not "literally" animating.
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Anonymous2013-04-08 5:34
>>864
not again.
Someone is just using bahi for trolling purposes on /a/.
>>875
Yep, it makes sense why he's been tweeting and retweeting about the show these past few days.
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Anonymous2013-04-08 8:42
>>874
maaaaan why is the transformation scene in lame 3D?
It's totally the Gurren Lagann shots but animated with no dynamics.
even 3D could have looked good.
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Anonymous2013-04-08 8:43
>It's totally the Gurren Lagann shots but animated with no dynamics.
??
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Anonymous2013-04-08 8:45
>>879 hellllooooo--OOOO--ouuuu???
Are you serious?
Famous Hisashi Mori Gurren Lagann transformation? hah hah? Got it? Anyone?
Remember? Super sick awesome animation? remember?
Eh, they aren't really comparable. Gurren-Lagann's transfromation were Go Nagai style and completely ignored "lack of pieces" for the sake of coolness (plus it was a plot point). The transformation in the Obari OP isn't very good, but it's Yuusha-style: all the pieces fit and exist from the beginning. A better comparison would be the Yuusha anime transformation sequences.
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Anonymous2013-04-08 8:51
>>882
I have masturbated to this scene, Mori's speedlines squirted out like a massive pumpgun shot.
>>874 Profile of Masami Obari President of Studio G-1 NEO. As one of Japan's foremost animators, it's hardly an exaggeration to say that anyone who calls themselves a fan of robot animation is sure to know his name. Obari has used his skills as a mecha designer to create the robots for a wide range of projects. He is also active as a director.
Huh, nice of the uploader to include some English descriptions of the project.
>>887
Can't argue with that, but Death Billiards was pretty nice as well. While I didn't mind the use of CGI for the game of pool, I was wondering why didn't they have a go at drawing the balls as well? That might have been cool.
this is not just /a/, this is the entire fucking human race dude
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Anonymous2013-04-08 8:59
>>889
The 3D balls made me so angry.
At least they could have animated them in 2D first, then go 3D all over it, it would look more natural and dynamic.
YOSHINORI GOD KANADA - god of dynamics
MITSUO GOD ISO - god of gravity
ITANO GOD CIRCUS - god of fucking missles
HIROYUKI GOD OKIURA - god of realism
TOSHIYUKI GOD INOUE - god of perfection
SHINYA GOD OHIRA -god of surrealism
YUTAKA GOD NAKAMURA - god of action
Nakazawa is cool. When is he actually doing more than KA for shitty anime next?
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Anonymous2013-04-08 9:20
edit:
YOSHINORI GOD KANADA - god of dynamics
MITSUO GOD ISO - god of gravity & god of working under different pen names
ITANO GOD CIRCUS - god of fucking missles
HIROYUKI GOD OKIURA - god of realism
TOSHIYUKI GOD INOUE - god of perfection
SHINYA GOD OHIRA -god of surrealism
YUTAKA GOD NAKAMURA - god of action
MASAMI GOD OBARI - god of robots
SHINGO GOD YAMASHITA - god of digital animators
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Anonymous2013-04-08 9:24
Yoshinari You - Explosions
Yoshinari Kou - Post-processing
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Anonymous2013-04-08 9:26
>>895
You forget Jun Arai, god of the animation that doesn't move
Ryo-timo was definitely the first web-gen animator that got popular then turn pro but I'd say Yama is ahead of him at the moment.
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Anonymous2013-04-08 11:05
edit:
Dat shit list bneed to grow up , i add my man
YOSHINORI GOD KANADA - god of dynamics
MITSUO GOD ISO - god of gravity & god of working under different pen names
ITANO GOD CIRCUS - god of fucking missles
HIROYUKI GOD OKIURA - god of realism
TOSHIYUKI GOD INOUE - god of perfection
SHINYA GOD OHIRA -god of surrealism
YUTAKA GOD NAKAMURA - god of action
MASAMI GOD OBARI - god of robots
SHINGO GOD YAMASHITA - god of digital animators
ANNO HIDEAKI - god of special effects
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Anonymous2013-04-08 11:10
YOSHINORI GOD KANADA - god of dynamics
MITSUO GOD ISO - god of gravity & god of working under different pen names
ITANO GOD CIRCUS - god of fucking missles
HIROYUKI GOD OKIURA - god of realism
TOSHIYUKI GOD INOUE - god of perfection
SHINYA GOD OHIRA -god of surrealism
YUTAKA GOD NAKAMURA - god of action
MASAMI GOD OBARI - god of robots
SHINGO GOD YAMASHITA - god of digital animators
ANNO HIDEAKI - god of special effects
JUN ARAI - god of KANADA SHADED style
YOSHINORI GOD KANADA - god of dynamics
MITSUO GOD ISO - god of gravity & god of working under different pen names
ITANO GOD CIRCUS - god of fucking missles
HIROYUKI GOD OKIURA - god of realism
TOSHIYUKI GOD INOUE - god of perfection
SHINYA GOD OHIRA -god of surrealism
YUTAKA GOD NAKAMURA - god of action
MASAMI GOD OBARI - god of robots
SHINGO GOD YAMASHITA - god of digital animators
ANNO HIDEAKI - god of special effects
JUN ARAI - god of KANADA SHADED style
YOH YOSHINARI - god of Yoh Yoshinari
SATORU UTSUNOMIYA - god of 3s timing
TAKESHI KOIKE - God of very high contrast
seriously guys, there are so many animators, director and producers from the industry on twitter. Why isn't anyone just asking all of them what Iso has been up to lately. I'm sure one of them is going to reply back.
And one of the best chara designers. He has made some of the most notable designs in the past 20 years. And his colab with Hosoda is fantastic. I'm surprised none of you guys mentioned him before on the "top designers" listings. He sure is one of my favourites.
Just as a side info, Yoshiyuki Sadamoto was best animator back then in his student years in all japan.
He animated better than Inoue, Iso and anyone else. It's a shame he stopped before he even started, he would probably be the king now among Iso.
>>954
Basic motions like those in the video are pretty handy for comparing technique. I don't know if better than Iso, Inoue and everyone else, but that "energetic sprinting" is absolutely top-notch.
I'm sure Sadamoto would have been an insane animator had he continued his career.
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Anonymous2013-04-09 3:25
The only problem in japan is that if you want to make complex cut instead a simple one, the price remain the same so most of animator do it the simple way. But i know some warrior able to work a full week for just 100$ for the love of animation.
>>960 not bad for middle east as a first anime project, this could develop into top quality if they keep this running. They could collaborate with japan, would be better than all the cheap labor work in philippines and such. At least we would have decent in-betweens in anime then.
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Anonymous2013-04-09 8:19
>>961
Yeah.. seems they are animating "anime style" and not looked at regular animation first.
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Anonymous2013-04-09 8:49
>>957
But i know some warrior able to work a full week for just 100$ for the love of animation.
-
Without these warriors, anime sakuga would look decent.
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Anonymous2013-04-09 10:00
If any of you are looking for some modern anime with a "retro" look, feel free to check out Sparrow's Hotel. It's incredibly hard to find anime with similar visuals these days.
Fuck animation. What anime really needs, and what it really has over animation produced in other parts of the world are interesting layouts. A good layout makes for two thirds of the quality of the film. The animation only has to settle for one third. That is why great directors like Oshii bother to check up on things only down to the layout level.
>>977
Well, layouts have often been the strong points of anime.
I remember reading something on anipages that said sure the animation of anime looks cheap and limited, but the layouts in anime shows are often very good. Mind you this was about shows from the 80s, but some of it probably still applies today.
When I look at western cartoons that have action in them I can never stomach them because the layouts are always so horrible even the if the "animation" has more frames in them.
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Anonymous2013-04-09 14:42
>>977
Well, layouts are a part of the animation process. The movement only happens in a defined layout, often drawn by the same animator who does the genga. It's not like you have a 'set' where you insert the characters into, the way you draw the image is part of the animation because it defines how it'll move.
That said, I think good timing and movement are important parts as well, especially for action scenes (which are, coincidentally, the most highlighted and 'popular' type of sakuga scenes)
Nah, good layouts with shit animation will always look better than good animation in poor layouts.
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Anonymous2013-04-09 14:57
>>977 Fuck animation
Fuck off and create a "cinematography appreciation" thread for this shit, faggot. This is an animation thread, if you aren't interested in discussing animation go away.
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Anonymous2013-04-09 15:02
>>980 good layouts with shit animation will always look better
Nah, I'm staying. Just to make your faggot balls blue as fuck.
Good "cinematography" and voice acting is enough to make for a decent anime. Animation is just bling. If I wanted to watch shit for the character acting and animation, I'd watch Spongebob.
>>988
I thought it had good animation, but surely people weren't expecting something insane? I mean, it's not Hongo+Ascension like in Kizuna Ichigeki, and it's not Yoshinari+Trigger like in LWA.
That said, I was expecting more from Aya Suzuki's cuts. The timing was too "generic anime", coming from an animator with experience in western animation and who was scouted by Kon, Hosoda and Ghibli, it was not that impressive.
About layouts, again, layouts and actual animation are so closely related that splitting them apart is meaningless. Both of them should be good, >>983 is just being a conformist.