Here's the (almost)HD version.
I like it. The CG is leagues beyond the crap in 2.0 (even though I would've preferred some pencil-on-paper mecha smashing angels in space more) and the art direction is great... like, really great,
No real sakuga stand-outs so far (6 minutes, what'd you expect?) but Asuka's animation was nice and I'm digging the explosions.
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Anonymous2012-11-16 10:55
SAKUGA IS OVER.
We should rename this Animation Mourning Thread #8
Was there anyone listed as Chief Animation Director for Nichijou?
TSR - Horiuchi(Gonzo)
Air - Aratani
Haruhi - Shoko Ikeda
Kanon/Clannad - Kazumi Ikeda
K-ON - Horiguchi
I was wondering who the Chief AD for Nichijou is. K-ON!! onwards didn't have anyone listed under that. Even without listing it for K-ON!! its pretty obvious.
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Anonymous2012-11-16 11:53
Hand drawn mecha animation is dead. Soon there will be a generation of 2D animators who've never done any mechanical animation.
Most anime fans are already so used to CG mecha that they don't care. Many of them even prefer CG.
Latest SSY episode:
4 animation director
6 assistant animation director
Troubled production looks like
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Anonymous2012-11-16 11:58
>>64
Oh dear. I thought a good chunk of it was made in advance? I remember the trailers showing a lot of scenes far into the show.
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Anonymous2012-11-16 12:03
>>61
Haruhi 2009 episodes had a different AD right? I recall someone saying she was pregnant so she was unable to work on it, hence the new episodes having a different look.
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Anonymous2012-11-16 12:06
>>62
That is a saddening thought but most mecha animators today are in their late 30s and 40s.
You only see odd youngsters doing mecha, they tend to be the super talented guys like Amemiya, Kameda, Hironori Tanaka, Kim Sejun and so on.
>>68
Yes, he did a cut on the Debander OP that was posted earlier in the thread.
He also worked on this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xzc-9y9MIQY
>Yoshimichi Kameda, Amemiya Akira, Mutaguchi Hiroki, Masakazu Sunagawa & Shingo Fujii and 1 or two others worked on that scene.
what do you guys think general japanese artist like the most in their piece ?
The plan (camera choice)
The overall composition (putting elements between them)
The details (putaing a lot of drawing details on clothes for example)
The line movment of the bodies (look like the elements are moving in the pic)
The subject choice (drawing something fantasy , or political ,whenever)
The ink art (lines art and such)
The coloring (colors choice )
etc
Sorry for y english (i'm not bahi or whenever)
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Anonymous2012-11-16 13:42
>>54
Interesting, the movie car chase sequence had hand-drawn cars.
But yeah.. Mecha animation is so much of a treat these days. It's so rare in most studios to pour their attention in that aspect.
I was really disappointed with the CGI used in Chu2koi's bonus preview. I was hoping they'd at least surprise us with their old stuff.
Also regarding this week's ep 7 of Chu2koi, I don't think it was that bad. The problem I think lies with balancing the mood. They didn't want to make things heavy. They really wanted to make this show fun but then again inserting Rikka's story was a contrast to that. The cuts weren't really stand out but there were good ones. Nothing wrong with the storyboarding as well. I just think they reserved their stuff for something better since this episode is obviously a set up for what's to come next week.
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Anonymous2012-11-16 13:50
>>54 SLS AMG engine inside truck A-Class revving to 8.5k RPM
What is this I don't even
At least the CGI cars look pretty good I suppose
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Anonymous2012-11-16 14:12
Eva 3.0 KA : Tadashi Hiramatsu, Sushio, Hiroyuki Imaishi, Shoko Nakamura, Akemi Hayashi
>>81
Probably busy working on Little Witch Academia
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Anonymous2012-11-16 14:54
Inoue gets last credit
Based fucking Inoue
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Anonymous2012-11-16 14:55
Now to wait for impressions from japanese sakugafags
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Anonymous2012-11-16 14:57
>>80
It's pretty much all of old Gainax all together minus Yoshinari and Kubota. Some of the best animators in Japan!! AND EVEN THEN THEY USE CGI FOR MECHA.
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Anonymous2012-11-16 14:58
>>85
Obviously they are not hung up about CGI like you fags seem to be.
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Anonymous2012-11-16 15:01
>>85
I'm sure there will be non-CGI mecha scenes just like in 2.0, and 3.0's CGI is not bad. It's a bit of a shame that they used CGI for that prologue, but that's how it is these days.
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Anonymous2012-11-16 15:03
Iso dead.
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Anonymous2012-11-16 15:04
yoshinari betrayed gainax and khara
jesus !!
I would love that people stop saying that eva 3.0 is all cgi
First , the cgi are very well done
second , we saw only the beginning of the movie
to finish the details and designs are way to hard to render it properly (especially the space device of eva unit 02 and unit 08)
so please quit it.
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Anonymous2012-11-16 15:05
If CGI is good enough for Inoue, then it's good enough for me.
Berserk 3rd movie. Maybe there will finally be some sakuga?
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Anonymous2012-11-16 17:27
>>101
never saw the berserk movies yet
damnit i need to make it
anyway nice explosions , what are the anime displayed please (except for star driver battle ending)
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Anonymous2012-11-16 17:29
>>103
In order of appearance: [C], Bleach 341, Bleach Hell Verse movie, Sket Dance
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Anonymous2012-11-16 17:33
>>104
after that it is Star Driver and Tiger & Bunny
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Anonymous2012-11-16 18:11
>>64
Shin Sekai Yori #8
Kazuyoshi Yaginuma as storyboard
Masashi Ishihama as an animation director
Chikashi Kubota as an assistant animation director
KA: Kouichi Arai, Takashi Kojima etc
Also, funny how we have only seen 6 fucking minutes of EVA Q and everyone is like FUCK IT 3DCG EVA FUCK ANNO FUCK KHARA CG CGCGCGCG EVERYTHING WILL BE CG!!!
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Anonymous2012-11-17 10:29
Big Eva Q spoiler:
Mitsuo Iso's famous End Of Evangelion scene will be animated by Inoue, but it will be totally different and Asuka will not die this time.
That's why she has the eyepatch later.
That scene will be the opening scene of the film.
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Anonymous2012-11-17 10:31
>>136 source of this spoiler appeared on 2ch somewhere.
it can't be find anymore.
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Anonymous2012-11-17 10:34
>>133
Some strong animation in that one piece movie.
"The opening scene is really quite incredible. There’s a lot of use of panning and revolving camera work. All the action is pretty good and the detail in some of the scenes are really phenomenal."
I died with the last words...
I want a screener NOW.
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Anonymous2012-11-17 12:26
>>143
Uh, did you not see the first 6 minutes that's been posted on youtube?
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Anonymous2012-11-17 12:32
Sorry
It wasn't me actually writing that review
But someone on evanerds ?
I believe he saw the entire movie
read acrefully i believe he talks about the entire movie in that words
My hype is the maximu level
I can't handle (i'll die)
I don't think there'll ever be a 2d Macross again. Which is really sad. Macross Plus was really amazing. Nothing can beat awesome animated 2d scenes. Itano, Muraki other well known dogfight animators should work on one last masterpiece.
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Anonymous2012-11-18 15:04
>>186
I thought Psycho-Pass is made by Wit Studio?
Oh wait , miyazaki was seeking some plane animator for his next movie
Maybe , this could revive the 2d plane dogfights.
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Anonymous2012-11-18 15:27
>>187
Well for them, missile circus animation is really time consuming. You just draw frame after frame of smoke trail of smoke trail. They get fed up.
I think circuses can be done great in CG as long as the camera work and timing is right. Macross Zero was great in that regard. Blassreiter also had some great CG action and that was a Gonzo TV series. That speaks volumes about Itano's skills. The "smoke" effects in the Q preview were also really cool. The problem with Macross Frontier as I remember it and what I've seen from the new Yamato is that floaty weightless feeling the ships move with.
To be fair, back in the hand drawn days they often didn't move at all but relied on camera tricks to make a static drawing appear to be moving. Now we get movement even if it often feels like it's on rails. Is that a good trade-off? (I don't know)
If we compare Macross then Zero (good CG in high budget OVA) is a better comparison with Plus (good hand drawn in high budget OVA) than Frontier. If they didn't use CG in the latter it's not like there would be animation like in Plus just because of it.
Right now Japan's CG animators are not on the same skill level as their 2D counterparts but the only way for them to ever be is to continue working and develop their techniques. Util then I'm happy companies like Bones continue to deliver great 2D mecha shows.
>>209
Between this and the Batman shorts, they're certainly working on it. I'll certainly welcome our Chinese overlords when the time comes.
>>208
Looks really bland in just about every aspect. I also wish that they had used the novel character designs instead of Kishida Mel's; novel's look lot more interesting.
>>264
That's some fucking brilliant mecha animation.
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Anonymous2012-11-20 18:05
>>264
That is some great water animation from Nakamura.
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Anonymous2012-11-20 18:19
>>263
Watch Fractale.
Episode 7 Ryotaro Makihara did the storyboard and Nobutake Ito as an animation director. KA Miyazawa, Shinichi Kurita, Shouko Nishigaki.
#5 Yuusuke Matsuo solo
#1 Hidetsugu Ito, Makihara
#4 Ryochimo, Chikashi Kubota, Kikuta, Komatsu, Shingo Adachi as storyboard.
#3#9 Umetsu #10 Kouno
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Anonymous2012-11-20 23:41
I feel bad for saying this but...after watching the E7 Ao finale, it feels like the itano circus is the fast food of anime fighting cuts. It's immediately gratifying yeah, but...it doesn't really make the fights anymore interesting and intense. Like I watched them, thought it was cool but I didn't really linger on them. Too many mecha anime use the circus as a crutch in place of actual fight choreography/composition. It feels overused and I'm rarely impressed by circus cuts these days.
>>268
I think a good Circus is one which allows the viewer to take in the action and feel like they are right in the middle of all the chaos rather than observing from fixed position at a distance. I like it when the "camera" follows the missile trail or goes in between them.
My favorite circus. I guess I like the more realistic portrayal and animated background. Some of the crazier stuff is fun too but it can be pretty but boring if they don't let the camera in on the action. Muraki's circus in Star Driver's finale for example.
But stuff from the start of the E7AO video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dOGWU_dkS-w
It's too many things happening at once, the viewer has no time to settle their eyes on a single thing since so much rapid action is going on.
With the star driver example, the mech is the focal point and you can see it flow in and out of the scene while firing lasers.
>>287
I wish Masami Goto was still active.
What was his last work?
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Anonymous2012-11-21 16:55
so uh
any Hotaru RAWs yet?
Name:
Anonymous2012-11-21 17:05
>>293
He does still work, but like I said above, he draws very simple and plain animation nowadays.
Looking at his ANN:
(2011) Blue Exorcist (TV) : Key Animation (eps 2, 24)
(2011) Wagnaria!! Season 2 (TV) : Key Animation (ep 6)
(2011) (The) Future Diary (TV) : Key Animation (eps 17, 25)
(2012) Space Brothers (TV) : Key Animation (ep 3)
(2012) Lagrange - The Flower of Rin-ne (TV 2) : Key Animation (ep 3)
I recall someone saying that he did some layout work for some of the CGI missile action in the Macross Frontier movie.
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Anonymous2012-11-21 17:08
>>295
Poor guy must've been hit hard by his Bebop circus.
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Anonymous2012-11-21 17:20
>>296
Actually, I think it is after this Gonzo movie from 2006 that he tired out and over worked himself: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RsQHEfZo6NA (That's what the sakuga wiki says anyway)
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Anonymous2012-11-21 17:27
Circus till I die
Masami Goto
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Anonymous2012-11-21 17:28
Only Itano can survive a circus
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Anonymous2012-11-21 17:29
Someone should give Itano an Oscar
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Anonymous2012-11-21 17:29
>>297
That also seems like a lot of work, I take it the effects are animated on 1s?
>>311
Well, look at his works for the last 10 years. He only does directing or CG effects directing.
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Anonymous2012-11-22 6:17
Norio Matsumoto, Yamashita Hiroyuki, Yamashita Shingo, Matsutake Tokuyuki... a lot of great animators on NS #290, as expected.
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Anonymous2012-11-22 7:18
>>313
Damned
I thought he got lazy since he became a living God with the first macross movie.
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Anonymous2012-11-22 8:22
What is animemirai?
They have lots of great sakuga but the projects are kind of uninteresting in general. Is that the young animator thingy?
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Anonymous2012-11-22 8:52
>>316
It's the new name of the Young Animator Training Project.
>>314
I'm guessing Shingo Yamashita animated where the viewer could see the silhouettes of people fighting among the fire. Pretty cool animation for that episode.
Yutaka Nakamura, Mitsuo Iso and Shinya Ohira are the most innovative animators.
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Anonymous2012-11-22 19:16
>>332 Yutapon and Iso have definitely the best timing.
Not sure about Yutapon and innovation, he is definitely very creative.
I agree with you about Iso, there is an Interview with someone where Iso is mentioned as the guy who revolutionized FX animation, specially smoke and dust.
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Anonymous2012-11-22 19:17
>>332 sup Iso, didn't knew you and Yutapon were in battle.
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Anonymous2012-11-22 19:20
Yutapon's animation is like motion graphics style.
I was looking at Matsumoto's work in Chikara #1 and I noticed that his smear frames remind me of Tetsuya Takeuchi's. Is this just a coincidence, or have they worked together before?
I can cross out other things but if Ishidate is still missing in the end then this gives it a lot more chance. Yamada hasn't done anything since the early eps. She only did 1 KA and directed the ED.
I also find it strange that they're missing. Especially Yamada and Horiguchi. They didn't have that much work in Hyouka and I expected them to be here. There's definitely something in the works right now.
While some may K-ON and it's very unlikely considering the mangaka already ended it on a very personal note.
Only thing I'm really thinking about is the possibility Kyoukai no kanata would be their next work. It's pretty logical if their goal is to push their LN business.
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Anonymous2012-11-23 9:05
>>353
But do they have enough material? Come to think about it, they could just change things heavily though, like what they did for Chuu2. How many titles to they publish currently anyway?
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Anonymous2012-11-23 9:08
>>352
So is it safe to say that Takeuchi's animation style takes after Matsumoto's?
I can see this being sponsored by TBS and Pony Canyon again.
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Anonymous2012-11-23 9:18
That does seem very plausible.
I can see them handing the finale to Animation Do staff.
Remember. Ikeda still hasn't been assigned to an ep yet.
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Anonymous2012-11-23 9:19
>>356
Wow, all of them have only one volume out save for Chuu2. But as mentioned earlier, it certainly is logical to expect them to adapt one of their published LNs.
>Mirai is isolated because of her ability to manipulate blood, which is unique even among members of the spirit world. Disturbing events begin to unfold after Akihito saves Mirai.
As vague as that seems, can we expect some bloodbath to happen in a KyoAni anime soon? I really miss how bloody that particular scene in TSR ep 4 was.
If Ishidate is in it, we got a big chance to see that happen.
Though I'm wondering who the director would be if in case this is their next show. This will be a huge contrast if Yamada gets this one.
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Anonymous2012-11-23 9:34
>>355
I don't know, Takeuchi came out of Productin IG Niigita and he's only been working since the early 00s. Do you have any images of this comparison you see? Upload pics to imgur or something.
>>366
Actually you are right, Takeuchi is one of Matsumoto's followers, I forgot where I read this but it matches up with what I had in a txt file regarding animator relationships.
In fact I'll just leave this here since I attempted to make an animator relations chart a few months ago http://i.imgur.com/yOmyY.png
I stopped because it was getting ever more complicated and a lack of knowledge hindered me.
that's fun. I have to say that's a nice attempt, but a lot of these are just based on internet information, so just a nice attempt.
But Tetsuya Takeuchi was influenced by Toshiyuki Inoue and Hiroyuki Okiura. He had nothing to do with Matsumoto.
Takashi Hashimoto and Mitsuo Iso is also wrong.
Iso was influenced by Osamu Tanabe.
Talking about Osamu Tanabe, why isn't he in the list? He was a major Influence.
Takashi was influenced by Hideki Kakita, I find it strange that Kakita is not visible in your list.
Jun Arai and Imazaki Itsuki were directly influenced by Kanada, not Masashita.
Ohira was influenced by Kanada too, this might sound crazy but it's true.
Hashimoto's influence was his brother, but he was not a famous animator.
Utsunomiya was influenced by Iso.
Yasuomi Umetsu and Toshiyuki Inoue were influenced by Katsushiro Otomo and Hidekazu Ohara.
Sushio was also infleunced by Otomo.
Otomo was not popular as an animator but he was a mentor to many of the seniors.
Yoshinori Kanada was influenced by the guy he did the sketchy Tiger Mask opening.
It's right that Yoshida was influenced by Miyazaki.
But Shinji Otsuka was never under Miyazaki's influence,
Otsuka was inspired by Osamu Tanabe.
>>378 I never heard about Osamu Tanabe before.
Where can I find sakuga clips by him?
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Anonymous2012-11-23 14:53
>>377
To be fair, he did say his list is far from complete. Anyway, I do think that it's likely that Takeuchi has been influenced by Inoue, but Okiura too? Now that's news to me.
Anyway, how do you know those bits of information?
It is more and more apparent that many cuts from the climax battle between EVAs aren't using that many animated CGI models. That said, the AAA Wunder lift-off scenes from the camrip are just weird, there is no right sensation of weight in them.
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Anonymous2012-11-23 15:07
>>385
Wow, that looks great. Also, is it just me, or the character animation seems better this time around?
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Anonymous2012-11-23 15:08
world famous artist Takashi Murakami explains the Yoshinori Kanada style
>>377
Woah there mate, no need to be so condescending...
Like I said I stopped because I didn't know much and eventually stopped. If you want, you can make your own chart, I posted on twitter and people made similar comments.
>Why haven't you included so and so
It's just a very complicated and futile attempt in the end. Because there are cases where masters are influenced by their followers or an animator follows one path then later completely changes his style later on like Hasashi Mori.
My starting point was a post in the 2ch sakuga thread that had a smaller version of that chart.
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Anonymous2012-11-23 15:15
Hayao Miyazaki's favorite animators are Osamu Tanabe and Shinji Otsuka.
Mamoru Hosoda's favorite animator is Toshiyuki Inoue.
Mamoru Oshii's favorite animator is Tetsuya Nishio.
Masaaki Yuasa's favorite animator are Nobutake Ito and Shinya Ohira.
>>390
It's okay, I guess I was a little defensive.
Though one point I am certain of is
>Takashi Hashimoto and Mitsuo Iso is also wrong.
The web anime style interview with Hashimoto, the interviewer asks him what "school of animation" he would belong to and in the end Hashimoto says:
>大平君テイストもあるし、磯さんテイストもあるし、大張さんテイストもある
>(I) have an Ohira taste, an Iso taste and an Obari taste.
He says he's a mixture of all of them.
I eventually stopped because I realised I needed to rearrange the entire chart because of an interview between Hashimoto and Muraki where they explained that Obari's influence also comes from Itano/Anno.
I was doing this in an Excel spreadsheet manually, the thought of rearranging everything was very daunting so I just gave up.
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Anonymous2012-11-23 15:38
>>374
1:37's Smile Precure mecha is Obari not Arasan
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Anonymous2012-11-23 15:41
>>401 I didn't knew about that. interesting
I've only seen a lot of praise for Kakira in his tweets, that's were my guess came from
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Anonymous2012-11-23 15:51
Ogura wrote that Bahi JD's Apollon keys are published in Animestyle 002 http://animestyle.jp/news/2012/10/31/2798/
So that's why he couldn't get permission to upload them on his tumblr.
I'm too lazy to buy that, hope he can upload them on tumblr soon.
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Anonymous2012-11-23 15:53
>>403
I think regarding Kakita, they are just good friends that worked together often. He mentioned Kakita several times in the web anime style interview. They both came from the 80s OVA boom so they have a lot of shared background.
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Anonymous2012-11-23 15:56
>>404 If uploading your genga on web would be so easy, then we would have seen a lot more material.
I don't think he will ever get that permission.
All the genga from tv shows available on the web were scanned from groundworks, magazines or any other kind of published books.
something like the Proto Anime Cut that was in germany.
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Anonymous2012-11-23 19:02
>>414
They display art from anime works in small events in Japan many times. https://twitter.com/honnyaku_blog < this guy often goes to them and takes pictures.
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Anonymous2012-11-23 19:22
>>377
>Takashi Hashimoto and Mitsuo Iso is also wrong.
No. Ahshimoto ahs talked about Iso several times. Why do you say it's wrong.
And if you can't see Yamashita's influence on Arai you're not just blind but retarded
The story is random and strange but I liked the anime overall, fun!
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Anonymous2012-11-24 12:49
Berserk movies , i missed them
They are awesome ?
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Anonymous2012-11-24 12:57
>>432
It's quite disappointing in terms of animation, too many unnecessary transitions between hand drawn and CGI animation, the CGI rarely works well outside of the large-scale battles. The hand drawn parts themselves aren't too great either.
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Anonymous2012-11-24 15:03
So, I have a question for you sakuga guys.
What's the contribution of the enshutsu to the final product? I mean, most of the time what I call "direction" in my mind is actually the storyboard. When only one guy does both for an episode it's okay, but when there is a storyboard done by A that is being directed by B, what does B do exactly?
I've read in various places that the episode directors are responsible for the assignment of animators to cuts, the management of music, the handling of the script, and such. But how does that reflect in the episode we watch? It's obvious that if the episode seems great as a whole, it was well directed, but what are the variables the enshutsu influences that can be directly measured in the episode? Storyboard and animation supervision are pretty standalone and can be criticised and enjoyed on their own, but what is the contribution of the episode director, besides making the best use of the resources he has?
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Anonymous2012-11-24 15:21
>>434
I think you've covered most bases in trying to ask your question.
I remember reading some place that Enshutsu is closer to "Animation Director" in the western sense. Think of the enshutsu as the director on the set of a movie. He tells everyone how the scene will flow, what the actors will do, what emotions to use. The storyboard will often cover a lot of this, but depending on who is interpreting it, you can have a different outcome.
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Anonymous2012-11-24 15:35
Yeah, but my question is, is the enshutsu's work "palpable" in the same vein an animator, storyboarder, or sakkan's work is? You can pinpoint with a lot of accuracy who was responsible for what in an anime episode, and this is seen explicitly in the final product. But the enshutsu seems more like the person in charge of bringing the most out of all the other's work. The only thing I think they do specifically is direct the music, but even then I've seen a lot of "sound director" credits in anime, on an episodic basis.
I can somewhat tell the enshutsu did his job properly if the episode is good as a whole (voice acting, consistency of dialogue, pacing, etc), but I can't tell WHAT he did to make the episode good.
>>440 it's not officially confirmed that Inoue worked on that but I guess it's right.
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Anonymous2012-11-24 20:05
>>437 Character Designer is Mebae.
He is one of Atsuya Uki and Bahi JD's friends when they were doing lots of indie stuff.
Mebae was animator on Uki's Cencoroll.
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Anonymous2012-11-24 20:08
>>442 what is Atsuya Uki doing now?
Are they working on Cencoroll 2?
It was huuuuuge back then we he released Cencoroll, everyone was talking about it because Uki did everything by himself, except some key-animation support by mebae.
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Anonymous2012-11-24 20:11
>>443 Uki became character-designer and freelance illustrator after Cencoroll, everyone thought he would become the next big anime director, but I think that will take a while. He probably needs some time to get into it.
http://mangafox.me/manga/gundam_sousei/c019/1.html
Ichiro Itano was a character in this manga, a manga story about how Gundam was born. Itano looks a bit like Spike from Cowboy Bebop lol. This chapter and the next is about Itano.
Those were three people working at that time for Ogurakobo (Ogura Atelier), as the name of the image says. Is it now an independent studio or still affiliated to Production I.G?
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Anonymous2012-11-26 16:59
What do you guys think of Seikai no Senki and Seikai no Monshou animation-wise?
Also, what'd you say are some highlights of space battle/space scenes in anime (that aren't a variation of line spam a la Itano) in general?
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Anonymous2012-11-26 17:05
>>490
I've seen the first series and honestly can't recall any good animation. It's mostly low budget I think.
>>495
Don't know who this Takafumi Hori is, but that animator really did quite a lot of nice vehicle animation for Redline. It's wonderful to see hand drawn vehicles.
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Anonymous2012-11-26 20:13
@495, that's pretty old.
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Anonymous2012-11-26 23:52
This thread is really informative and I applaud you people for keeping it alive.
The only drawback I can see from this thread is the amount of KyoAni advocates in here. I will never really understand what's so good about them.
They're mediocre at best. The only thing that stood out in terms of animation is Nichijou and it was really not even that solid. K-ON comes next but was really turned off by the style which oftentimes leaves the characters disfigured.
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Anonymous2012-11-27 0:13
well we're the animation appreciation thread
of course we'll have an affinity to Kyoani. And any other studio that produces consistently strong (visually) work. That's all there is to it
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Anonymous2012-11-27 0:15
the Panty & Stocking animation book came out, anyone buy it?
shipping costs are insane, are there any other key-animation/production material books worth getting?
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Anonymous2012-11-27 2:30
>>499
>the style which oftentimes leaves the characters disfigured.
So what would you consider to be shows that stand out animation-wise?
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Anonymous2012-11-27 6:49
>>499
Well this is not about what stories they produce, I think you're letting your feelings about their shows cloud your view on their animation.
Compare a work like Chuunibyou, a 12 episodes show with another 12 episode slice of life show from, JC Staff, Sunrise, Production IG, AIC or Shaft. And notice how KyoAni retain a good sense of quality in their animation while the other studios will struggle to do the same.
Bones used to have good constant animation, but they've dropped the ball as of late.
Great animation and nice staff in Sakurasou 8.Keiko Takano, Ken'ichi Hirata, Yuu Kaneshiro, Hironori Sawada and Shinichi Iimura KA, amongst many others.
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Anonymous2012-11-27 11:43
>>506
This. Especially Psycho Pass. At least robotics note has some interesting cuts.
>>526
I like the reflection on the guardrail. I suppose Ohira oversees the coloring process of his cuts to achieve that look?
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Anonymous2012-11-27 19:08
>>527
Nope, not popular enough.
Come back in 30 years and maybe you might have one.
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Anonymous2012-11-27 20:22
madoka , evangelion and macross are not popular enough ?
damned!!
I hope they'll do something for evangelion, it could be very very interesting despite the ratings for eva was better i think (since gundam 0079 bombed in the beginning)
It could be very interesting how they handle 2d animation for characters , mechas , how anno was with his crew
How they decided to create the last episodes , and if end of evangelion was really already planned , how they deal with the death threats etc
Madoka is a revolution in everyway
How did it change the industry?
It's done something different and unique(as some of you faggot might believe), but that's it.
Many people even in Japan haven't even heard of Madoka while it was airing while air. It's not the same as Gundam or Macross franchises.
And I don't see why you have to bring up KyoAni's anime.
No one is claiming that those shows are revolutionary either.
If you're so butthurt that people like KyoAni, just go back to your haters' circlejerking club on MAL.
Nothing in manga form but there are plenty of interesting production anecdotes about Eva. I know there's a whole doujinshi full of stories about how fucking crazy Ikuhara during Sailor Moon from the staff there, but was a 90s copy-bon so we'll probably never get to see it.
>>539
I'm hoping Shaft will put some effort into Sasami-san.
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Anonymous2012-11-28 5:05
Ohira's Hotaru scene was fabulous!
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Anonymous2012-11-28 5:21
>>539
Ore no Kanojo to Osananajimi ga Shuraba Sugiru - Kanta Kamei, A-1
Yama no Susume - Yuusuke Matsuo
Vivid Red Operation
Boku wa Tomodachi ga Sukunai NEXT - Hong Shen as main animator.
Judging by how things are going. They're actually on a tight schedule now. It's like 2009 again.
That, I'd like to see as well. Ishidate as director and Ueno chief AD would be interesting.
I can see Ishidate getting a shot at directing a show if has less work to do here. Also brace for Haruhi S3. The chance is by far a lot better now since it'll be slated for next year. This gives Ishihara a lot of room to work on it.
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Anonymous2012-11-28 11:49
Two TBS shows in a row for KyoAni.
The next one is likely to be Kadokawa's.
Probably FMP(Takemoto/Ishidate+Nishiya) or Haruhi(Ishihara+Ikeda/Nishiya)
lol.
>>576
It would be really weird to not get an Ishihara/Ikeda episode in the entire show considering they're director/AD. It was weird enough not to have them on the first one, and I highly doubt they'll work on the BD-only ep. Rooting for some Ishidate KA myself.
>>580
Nichijou had Ishihara in the first episode. They've broken their tradition of director and chara designer working in the first episode with Chuu2Koi, so I expect them to appear in the finale. But who knows, really.
>>581
Kyoukai no Kanata has an awful and generic premise, to be fair. Not like they'd mind diverging from the source material, but I'm excited about KyoAni going full original. And we're sure to get that later on anyway.
That's because they're from the same fucking chara designer... Jesus, some people really are that stupid.
When will the pleb anime fandom get over the damn "studio phase"? This shit is the same as saying that the characters in Honneamise, Nadia and Evangelion look similar because they were animated by Gainax.
People probably still think that K-On was done entirely by middle-aged neckbeards. Most anime fans don't really bother looking at staff, this is especially amusing when they refer to an A-1 production.
I wonder how many mistakes there are in most sakuga MADs if there's this much uncertainty even about Ohira's animation.
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Anonymous2012-11-29 10:25
Picked this up from a thread on /m/, does this make any sense?
That is a thing with modern animators, they to tend to reduce the detail of fast moving objects to make them more flexible, but I actually think this is kanada's fault.
He was often referenced as the best fight scene animator and he tends to reduce the details on the weapons when they are moving, as well as simplify the debris into squares.
Modern animators apparently picked on those ideas and took them to unreasonable levels, at best just making the characters pliable shapes at worst horribly distorted blobs, like in the pain naruto fight.
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Anonymous2012-11-29 10:38
>>582
Hyouka season 2?
Wow
they copy evrything and they copy themselves among their own series...
WOW
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Anonymous2012-11-29 11:18
>>645
Well, he's on the right lines some what. If you have too much detail then you have to spend more time drawing a cut. Animators are paid based on the number of cuts they do. If they are having to spend more time drawing per cut then they are losing out money. So they lessen the detail so they can work faster and do more cuts.
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Anonymous2012-11-29 11:20
>>645
Many anime fans would rather have a static, well drawn picture for 20 minutes, that's nothing new. Fluid animation with no regards for character designs scares them.
it makes sense to reduce the details on fast action scenes, or would you see all the small details on a huge spacing?
It's just like reality, imagine you have a carpet with detailed patterns, you wouldn't see those details if the carpet would fly around in super speed.
>>660
It's rather surprising that this arc may very well turn out to be rather consistent in terms of animation. It'll probably be the most polished consecutive episodes the series will ever get.
Itano is kinda the current Kanada you know boys.
I didnt knew he was like that , was thinking he only created the itano circus .
he is more polyvalent than i thought.
The smoke observation is crazy , always trying to check everything alive huh?
Thanks for the discovering ,One punch man and that gundam manga are my current favorite readings.
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Anonymous2012-12-01 9:38
>>712
>Itano is kinda the current Kanada you know boys.
Do you know when those events mentioned in the manga take place? 1979/1980. This is hardly "current".
>>719
Araki ? Great, hopefully he will direct and storyboard more episodes himself this time.
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Anonymous2012-12-01 17:02
Shikama in SAO #22 was pretty damn cool, and thanks to Nagai's storyboard, the episode had a really nice flow to it. Sugu and Kirito exchange at the end had a pretty good character acting too.
There is a world of difference between animating an 'action' scene such as a fight etc. in a slice of life series and animating an actual action sequence which has a flow of events.
An action sequence has a number of 'flags' which chain these events together, else they would just be a collection of things happening. For example a car flips over, collides with a lamppost is a flag, which then causes the lamppost to bend and strike a building window which shatters at the same time as the car's trajectory changes and rotates at a completely different angle which is a flag for the people in the car to be flung in a different direction and for something else to come into view etc. etc. etc. you could go on forever describing every small detail.
It's a lot of hard work and imagination and doesn't just depend on the number of inbetween frames. People consider old 80s and 90s action series to be better than today, the common argument is that 'x anime is better animated because it has more frames', but it's not necessarily the number of frames or fluidity that make better animation as the mind will naturally fill in these gaps if they aren't there. The reason the classics are considered so despite seeming less polished or less fluid than current series is because the action sequences themselves are much more interesting and inventive.
It's like an ugly girl made to look pretty with lots of airbrushing and photoshop compared to a pretty girl looking naturally pretty without any of these things...you can carry this analogy across to hollywood movies and music too.
The two (animators and storyboad artists) work together very closely though, which is why if 50 of KyoAni's animators were to move to another studio the quality of the anime KyoAni produce would not change. It's like programming, anybody can learn to read and write a programming language but a good programmer is someone who thinks like a programmer. It's not about how much code you can write, it's about how creatively you can come up with solutions to problems in the most eloquent way.
The point is that animators are doing monkey-work basically, not to discredit from what they do...but if a number of animators were to be transferred, then the animation would be down to the remaining number of animators meaning that while less frames (and thus, less fluidity) would be able to be drawn, the animation itself wouldn't change...the same things would be happening. Essentially the point I'm getting at here is that quality of animation is not a simple matter of number of frames, just like the speed of a car is not just about the size of the engine. KyoAni are often praised for being good animators but the reality is that while it looks impressive, a lot of it is really just a lot of frames drawn to make it look more fluid.
SO why're you guys still talking about monkeys of the anime industry?
how delusional do you have to be to come up with stuff like that
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Anonymous2012-12-02 14:43
>The point is that animators are doing monkey-work basically
arasan will be devastated
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Anonymous2012-12-02 15:09
>>741 too long didn't read. I can feel that this is written by someone without any life. Just the part with monkey-work makes me not to read this crap.
>>741 everything you wrote is fuck, except the part where you say " but it's not necessarily the number of frames or fluidity that make better animation"
Animation is about movement, it's not about fluid shit, that's a fact.
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Anonymous2012-12-02 15:22
very slow movement - 4's (fucking slowmotion scene)
slow movement - 3's (slow walking, doing normal stuff)
fast movement - 2's (running, fighting)
very fast movement - 1's ( beginning of an explosion, a thunder, fast punch)
and if you do all these kind of stuff in 1's, you are wasting lots of money and time.
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Anonymous2012-12-02 15:26
>>749
Wat, you can still display fast movements with fewer frames, thats the entire basis of the Kanada style. Despite having limited number of drawings to work with Kanada made action exciting to watch.
KyoAni anime aren't even that fluid. Compare it with something like Mushishi where the characters are done one 2s and the Mushi are on 1s, giving them an otherworldly feel.
That being said, Mushishi still takes a lot more shortcuts compared to your average "sakuga anime" from BONES, KyoAni. Lots of panning from the ground while the characters are talking, backgrounds etc. What I'm trying to say is that KyoAni anime do have more frames but they also have more movement in general. It was never about fluidity, just actual movement.
Everything after the first episode has been mediocre to bad. I haven't read the source material, but most of the new characters for this arc seem horribly miscast.
That's what I've heard. I just mean that I haven't read the source material, so I'm not intimately familiar with the recently introduced characters, but at first glance they seem really miscast (especially OnoD, something about that is just wrong).
What "great character animation" are you talking about here?
It's choke full of mediocre cuts. Let's take that chunk in 789 for example, lots of stiff (or downright weird) movements (the god-awful water animation notwithstanding), full of really short cycles... etc.
It was your "every anime ever".
not at all. I'm really flabbergasted here, you'd have to blind or stupid to not notice how detailed some of the movements are. That silly dance alone in episode 4 was pretty great. God awful water animation? Just look at it! Look at those sprays of water and that head turn. Shit looks pretty dynamic to me
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Anonymous2012-12-04 14:34
>Look at those sprays of water and that head turn. Shit looks pretty dynamic to me
I remind me the awesome intro animation for valkyrie profile (a rpg)
I wonder , who generally do those animations ? internal artist of video game studios ?
Are they well paid , better than classical animators for tv shows ?
What do you generally think of those animations ?
The animation of rival schools are also nice.
Animations on project X zone the new big 3ds game are awesome , especially the in-game extra attack animations , looks like a paint moving wich is i wonder how they are made.
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Anonymous2012-12-04 15:07
>>799
That intro was made by BONES and Hironori Tanaka worked in it
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Anonymous2012-12-04 15:18
ahhh , oh i see
video game studios outsource their job to animate so.
thanks for the info.
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Anonymous2012-12-04 15:24
Speaking of Tanaka, how does he manage to get so much work? He's always animating all sorts of things.
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Anonymous2012-12-04 15:34
>>799
Video game openings tend to be well animated most of the time because they don't have the restriction of a TV schedule and they can generally afford a better budget.
Many of the "Tales of ___" games have very nice intros by Production IG. Tales of Abyss for example, features that well known cut from Norio Matsumoto. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3gaMKbv-xHU
So Wit Studio for the "Shingeki no Kyojin" (Attack on Titan) adaption?
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Anonymous2012-12-05 7:44
>>810
Maybe, their debut work has the working title of "Project Attack". If that's true I'm not so sure if the staff can pull it off. The action is the manga is full of crazy fast movements, I don't know how the anime will pull it off with a typical tv anime budget.
>>813
While funny, that should have been something like Imaishi vs Yutapon or someone more 'real' in their animation. Amemiya is more Imaishi lite with a dash of Obari.
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Anonymous2012-12-05 12:14
Takemoto is on the (already short) KA list.
Still no Ishidate.
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Anonymous2012-12-05 12:25
>>821
So soon after Chuunibyou ends. Very exciting.
I wonder who'll be in charge of the last couple episodes (plus th e BD extra one, I guess). There's still a lot of people I'd love to see working on the show.
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Anonymous2012-12-05 12:35
>>824
Ishidate full directing debut might just be a real thing now! Very exciting.
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Anonymous2012-12-05 12:48
Takemoto episode huh? Looking forward to it.
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Anonymous2012-12-05 12:51
総作画監督：原田大基・佐々木貴宏・田中春香
Chief ADs for Shaft's Sasami-san
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Anonymous2012-12-05 12:57
Three people? What's the point in there being a chief AD then if the job going to be split among three people?
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Anonymous2012-12-05 13:00
>>830
Different ways to work, I guess. They might be ready for rushing stuff, you know how SHAFT schedules go. Considering A-1 (mostly) manages to output decent stuff with a zillion animations and ADs I don't find it worrisome.
Latest Chuunibyou episode: nothing eye popping animation wise but I was very impressed with the lighting effects during the scene under the bridge. The characters lit by the night lights reflecting off the river looked really good.
>>836
I was rather impressed with that too, so many scenes with beautiful lighting, not to mention Takemoto's awesome layout makes it even better. The animation was certainly better than 7-8 though.
Also, no wonder he was given this episode, that fucking script.
>>844
No, I don't think so.
They're all really good.
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Anonymous2012-12-05 19:34
Takemoto blew everyone out of the water with this Chuu2Koi episode. Wow.
>>844
She's the one I like the least, Ikeda is alright and I love Nishiya's work so far. That said, I've come to appreciate Horiguchi a lot more since everyone started trying to rip her off.
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Anonymous2012-12-05 19:34
>>844
I don't think her designs are bad per-se, but they've gotten really popular both inside and outside of Kyoani, and that's not a good thing.
I do think Nishiya has the best designs though, but I don't really see Horiguchi or the Ikedas as better or worse than each other.
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Anonymous2012-12-05 20:21
>>847
How many people have actually tried to "rip her off"? I can only really think of Toshifumi Akai.
Also I really don't see the selling point of Tamako Market. Synopsis is really mind boggling. Then again this is the animation thread so I'm expecting huge shift of quality here. Could this be the Dennou Coil of Yamada?
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Anonymous2012-12-06 5:45
Also I really don't see the selling point of Tamako Market
>>871
That's so interesting! Yawata is right next to Uji too where KyoAni HQ is.
>>872
Any reason not to be now? Seems like it will look pretty nice.
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Anonymous2012-12-06 12:31
If you're only after little girls in panties you must be excited indeed but I don't think that a true anime connoisseur is really looking forward this shitty anime
>>903
No Shinbo? How different is the staff compared to the previous -monogatari shows?
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Anonymous2012-12-07 6:48
>>900 >>901
Yeah, it's definitely unusual how much he's involved. But hey, I'm not complaining! There's probably going to be a good action scene since it's the climax and all.
Nor impressed.
At least not impressed with that PV itself so far.
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Anonymous2012-12-07 10:30
The writing has been pretty good so far for Zetsuen no Tempest. I quite enjoy that show. So chances of Yutapon working on ep14 are slim to none I take?
well, -monogatari is more about scene composition and special effects than animations (although Bakemonogatari and Nisemonogatari had some very nice animated scenes).
The Nekomonogatari PV has some nice small, subtle animations, so I'm pretty sure it will look fantastic but is not a show for an thread about animation.