hi /prog/
I am a first year student and I want to make myself as marketable as possible once I graduate. We started our first class learning to program in Java but I feel like the stuff we learned would be pretty useless elsewhere. so, what language should I try learning on my own now?
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Anonymous2008-12-15 18:15
Lisp
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Anonymous2008-12-15 18:21
Read SICP. Learn Python.
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Anonymous2008-12-15 18:30
Get an internship. That trumps everything.
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Anonymous2008-12-15 18:35
C#, .NET, things that real people in the real world use. Also algorithms, data structures, databases, the basics of networking and other practical stuff.
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Anonymous2008-12-15 18:35
>>4
Thats in the plan but I think learning a lot of useful languages along the way on my own would help as well. When I graduate, I don't want to look just like every other faggot with a piece of paper. >>3
WIll definitely check out python now. You are probably the 6th person to recommend it to me.
any links to this SICP book?
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Anonymous2008-12-15 18:37
>>6 any links to this SICP book?
Is your DNS broken, that you can't resolve Google?
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Anonymous2008-12-15 18:40
>>7
Google tells me it is a book that MIT uses for its begginer students. I imagine that cost money. That goes against my first rule of using the internet.
Unless I am mistaken, I would like for someone to post a torrent link or pdf.
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Anonymous2008-12-15 18:40
>>7
Google tells me it is a book that MIT uses for its beginner students. I imagine that cost money. That goes against my first rule of using the internet.
Unless I am mistaken, I would like for someone to post a torrent link or pdf.
Welcome to the SICP Web Site
Oct 23, 2001 ... SICP is a very well known text teaching the conceptual basis of programming. The full text is available on the web site.
mitpress.mit.edu/sicp/ - 6k - Cached - Similar pages - Filter - History
Didn't you even read the blurb, which says "The full text is available on the web site"?!?
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Anonymous2008-12-15 22:32
You are taking computer science, and they have a class teaching Java.
Things you should know:
1. Java will not teach you anything about computer science. While real CS programs will have you take a programming class 1st year, it would never be Java.
2. The school you are going to is terrible. Transfer now. What you are learning is computer software engineering (and will be learning until the end), not computer science. If the teachers don't even know that, then you will have a shit education.
3. I have refused to interview applicants based soley on the fact that their resume lists a CS degree because they either really did learn CS and are useless or they went to a school that doesn't know the difference and their education is useless. I have only recocidered this twice because the provided examples. Only one could step me through the code so he was the only one ever hired after that travisty of a mistake he made when he was young, ignorant and at the mercy of an education system that is more interested in tuition than education.
>>13 I have refused to interview applicants based soley on the fact that their resume lists a CS degree because they either really did learn CS and are useless
You turned them down because of their grades?
>>23
The problem is, students with higher grades tend to be socially awkward and, well, useless. We aim to get students with low to mid-level grades, as it indicates that they're willing to learn and they have the potential to improve their abilities.
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Anonymous2008-12-17 4:58
>>25
You totally want to hire me. But how do you know a prospective employee's grades?
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Anonymous2008-12-17 5:06
>>26
he pays fairX the haxxor enough to get access to his private area of gradez ;)
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Anonymous2008-12-17 5:07
>>26,27
It's not uncommon for employers to request an academic transcript together with a CV.
>>28
Probably it's only my area which does this, but we have an "Employment" mailing list which all CS undergrads are placed on. Almost ALL job opportunities / advertisements request an academic transcript, though probably only because it's targeted toward students
No, where I work we make web and desktop applications for the financial sector. People get turned down for having CS degrees for 1 of 2 reasons:
1. We don't hire real computer scientists. We don't need computer science. We need computer software engineers. Example: We have apps that do Monte Carlo simulations. A computer scientist would develop a pseudo-random number generator for that simulation. We don't need a new implementation of a fucking random number generator, plenty already exist. We need an engineer to implement a random number generator.
2. Many poor schools teach computer software engineering but call it CS (which it is not). If the school doesn't know the difference, then their education is generally crap. These are the kinds of schools that teach Visual Basic 6 as a class still. VB6 died 6 years ago, it is legacy and not in high demand in the marketplace. There is no fucking reason to learn it. They should be teaching VB.Net which is a different language with a simialr syntax. I see this too often.
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Anonymous2008-12-17 15:28
>>31 No, where I work we ENTERPRISE
You seem to be that angry guy who constantly RAGES about CS curricula (you are the only person in the world who uses the term `computer software engineering' in actual discussions, so you're quite easy to track). If you are not a troll, I pity you. You embody the ENTERPRISE way of thinking.
>>31
I don't really understand what the difference is. What exactly do you, as a "computer software engineer" have to offer over a Computer Science graduate? You both pretty much know the same stuff, so is it just a working knowledge of UML and other "software methodologies"? The kind of stuff you can learn over a weekend?
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Anonymous2008-12-17 16:13
>>34
Years of experience, for one.
I've delivered internet-enabled business applications to clients.
I've Integrated and synchronized with existing legacy infrastructure.
I know all of the latest web 2.0 technologies.
I know databases
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Anonymous2008-12-17 16:21
>>34
You impertinent little shit. You don't want to mess with me, buddy. I have 12 years of experience, I was coding before you could even talk. You want to know what the difference is? About five back accounts, three ounces and two vehicles.
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Anonymous2008-12-17 16:25
BUT HAVE YOUREAD SCIP
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Anonymous2008-12-17 17:03
>>32
I fucking lol'd, why did you quote the entire previous post word for word?
>>36
You impertinent little shit. You don't want to mess with me, buddy. I have 20 years programming experience writing HUGE programs that you couldn't even begin to comprehend. I wrote an ANSI C compiler when I was just 12 years old.
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Anonymous2008-12-18 5:57
>>40
You impertinent little shit. You don't want to mess with me, buddy. I have n+1 years of EXPERT PROGRAMMING experience writing factorials with monads you couldn't even begin to comprehed. I had read SICP already when you were still unborn.
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Anonymous2008-12-18 22:02
>>40
#1) you can't even use IRC well; #2) you can't tab-complete; #3) you can't google - this implies yer too busy jerking off and sucking soda or video-gaming. Die well, kid
OP can't handle SICP if he can't fucking type 'SICP' into google and go to the first link. GB2 ENTERPRISE
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Anonymous2008-12-20 23:37
OP wants advice on which language he should learn to become part of enterprise, he can't use fucking google, and took a computer science course where they taught java(which means hes probobly still in highschool).
who gives a fuck if enterprise fuckers like >>31
never hire programmers that aren't fit to sit in an office and make accounting programs? these people don't enjoy programming and see it as a profession instead of creating a work like an artist.
the same can be said of engineers in all fields, there are the engineers that sit in offices and design shovel handles all day, and there are the engineers who actually want to invent things.
eventually it comes down to >>43
and the fact that some artists will make art simply for the money, some artists will make art that you can buy at walmart on some shirt or some decorative plate.. and some artists will make art simply because they enjoy it, this is how it has always been and how it will always be nomatter what.
END OF THREAD.
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Anonymous2008-12-21 0:08
I would like to reopen this thread for further discussion. I believe that it is an important topic which warrants a fuller appreciation and deeper exploration.
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Anonymous2008-12-21 0:22
>>46
the only thing that warrents fuller appreciation and extended exploration on /prog/ is SICP
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Anonymous2008-12-21 1:46
>>47
until we have divided SICP up into various books with each line assigned a specific reference number like the christian bible, we have not explored deep enough.
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Anonymous2008-12-21 3:24
Do not worry most larger companies once you have been hired will not fire you unless you give them HR Style (Gun, sex abuse, crazy, do not show up) cause. So get one of those find something useful like drawing UML pictures or writing documentation so the few people who actually do all the work want you around. Then just wait for the downsize layoff. Read SICP daily, learn the 5 hacking languages, Art of Programming, and do not send useless email.
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Anonymous2008-12-21 3:33
Yeah you are pretty useless so better work on your personality, find a large organization with a lot of bureaucracy, and buddy up with some smarter folks.
>>1
If you want to be marketable, learn stupid languages that will give you shitty money for 5 years or less, then get fired and treaten like shit forever.
Just do your godamn BSc and study what you find interesting. Don't think about enterprises or shit like that.
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Anonymous2008-12-21 4:15
Just learn C and Java. Well start with Python and then do C and then you might as well learn C++. Learn LISP because it is the GodFather of _all_ languages. So after Python do C and LISP first then Java and C++ and then learn Perl because it is the duct tape of the InterWebs. You can make bank with java but you really can clean up if you know all this because you have depth.
Yeah in the last order.
Oh almost forgot, Life ain't Nuthin' but bitches n' Money
Stick with GPL languages and GNU OS then you will build skills and not have to retool like those proprietary fools do. The cash is in mobile for Android and iPhone on short term and Java still is a money maker with the addition of being GPL which makes it a permanently profitable language. Stay away from Microsoft the shops suck, lack innovation, and the people are generally second rate with bad attitudes.
Learn the "mechanics" of software like documentation, build tools, unit testing, acceptance testing, and source control. Learn to use a GNU OS so you can make your own server farm.
Try to be financially self sufficient and then independent, so learn some accounting. If you can pull it off and you are earning off the Internet then remember nobody knows/cares what code lies behind the browser, so it can be Lisp or Python and whatever works for you and you can live with using long term.
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Anonymous2008-12-21 4:35
“If you want to get laid, go to college. If you want an education, go to the library.” Frank Zappa
Drop Out.
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Anonymous2008-12-21 4:46
>>58
"If you want people to believe you have an education, go to college." — Me
>>62
Dude, don't diss it. I feel ever so much better since I stopped eating that yellow snow.
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Anonymous2008-12-21 13:47
>>62
Zappa did not do drugs at all much less have an addiction
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Anonymous2008-12-21 14:25
"I could have made money this way, and perhaps amused myself writing code. But I knew that at the end of my career, I would look back on years of building walls to divide people, and feel I had spent my life making the world a worse place."
"Value your freedom or you will lose it, teaches history. 'Don't bother us with politics', respond those who don't want to learn."
is a problem of determining whether, given a logic expression with variables, the variables can be substituted with logic values, such that the expression evaluates to true.
Why 3SAT, 3?
????
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Anonymous2008-12-21 16:27
>>66
Because each sub-expression is made out of 3 boolean values.
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Anonymous2008-12-21 17:20
Zappa is completely correct, and all the Colleges are nothing but money grabbers, what is the point of going to college when i can watch MIT lecutres, take MIT tests, and do MIT classwork all for free from my computer?
I never have had as much sex since college and cannot conceive of a scenario in which sex would be even half as available.
Maybe in a rest home but who wants to have sex with old people, shit not even old people.
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Anonymous2008-12-21 23:03
>>75
your fucking stupid, you can get as much sex attending as you can by just living in a college town, minus the money.
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Anonymous2008-12-21 23:12
>>76 yeah I agree, when you are young and have game you can get tail. If you have game you can live anywhere.
Older with job, bills, fat, you look like a troll in a bar, you do not get invited, only the truly crazy ones want to sex you. College crowd just does not work out.
You do get the ass with game but College, man, bitches just giving it away because they found out how it works plus they just laying around in the dorm and you are too...
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Anonymous2008-12-21 23:14
>>77
Working all day at a real job takes the fun out of life.
Let's wait for Gerald J. Sussman's next book before we commit suicide.
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Anonymous2008-12-22 0:26
>>82 missed a perfect opportunity to say >>81 I will, along with my job.
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Anonymous2008-12-22 0:37
>>83 missed a perfect opportunity to say "GRUNNUR".
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Anonymous2008-12-22 0:51
Your school will do nothing but teach you how to write shitty code that any business would readily refuse. learn object oriented design patterns and functional programming if you want to get into systems development, or Object oriented Design, Java, and anything .NET if you want to do web development. You have 4 years.
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Anonymous2008-12-22 5:20
Your school will do nothing but teach you how to write shitty code that any business would readily refuse. learn object oriented design patterns and functional programming if you want to get into systems development, or Object oriented Design, Java, and anything .NEET if you want to do web development. You have 4 years.
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Anonymous2008-12-23 0:30
Don't do .NET there is nothing fun going on with that trap.
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Trollbot90002009-07-01 10:35
Just want it near screen size you already have data isolation and blocking becomes a serious discussion start a new website this line is always a huge nightmare Even if the max function is always a bad thing caused by an overcomplicated language.
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Anonymous2009-07-01 10:42
i wonder was i such a moran when i was a first year cs student
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Anonymous2010-12-17 1:17
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Are you a NIGGER?
Are you a GAY NIGGER?
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Anonymous2010-12-17 1:21
Are you GAY?
Are you a NIGGER?
Are you a GAY NIGGER?
If you answered "Yes" to all of the above questions, then GNAA(GAY NIGGER ASSOCIATION OF AMERICA) might be exactly what you've been looking for!