Why does the US support Israel?

I can't think of any advantages to the US supporting Israel, but I can think of a whole bunch of disadvantages.

>>39
smart man

>>39

Maybe, maybe not. We've not had a Jewish president yet, and god knows the media doesn't portray Israel all that well. In fact, I know several American Jews who rank among the biggest libfags of them all.

America is supporting Israel for the lulz. No other reason.

Do you touch yourself at night?

The Israeli housing ministry has invited tenders for the construction of 100 new homes at settlements in the occupied West Bank.

The houses are to be built at Ariel and El Kana in the northern West Bank, despite international calls for a freeze on settlement activity.

Israel argues its requirement to freeze settlements under the 2003 peace roadmap does not apply here.

Palestinian official Saeb Erakat said the building "sabotaged" peace efforts.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/7354146.stm

>>1
Numerous reasons, and if nothing else, dedication to foreign policy that is outdated.

Initially, support of Israel gave Jews a place to settle after WWII, have another partner in the Middle East, and whatever other paranoid reasons that various shills throw out. After a variety of gaffes on our part based on our dedication to Israel and oil, the entire area went (even more) to shit.

So, we now have a country which can be characterized directly or indirectly by any leader in the area who wants to put blame somewhere else for current conditions. Besides notions of Jewish plots and schemes, it seems the biggest reason to support Israel is the mere fact that we would take a severe blow to world view if we were to outright abandon a staunch ally at this point.

All of this is merely off the cuff notions, there is probably a lot more or a lot less to it. However: would abandoning Israel make the area more stable? would it make Muslim fundamentalists less likely to hate us? would we save money and lives in the long term? what would losing Mossad as an intelligence source do to us?

More informed people than the mighty toughguys of 4chan seem to think a qualified 'No' is the answer to the first three, and wouldn't like to even think of an answer to the last.

>>45

|"the biggest reason to support Israel is the mere fact that we would take a severe blow to world view if we were to outright abandon a staunch ally at this point."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appeal_to_tradition

|"Would abandoning Israel make the area more stable? would it make Muslim fundamentalists less likely to hate us? would we save money and lives in the long term?"

yes yes yes and yes

|"what would losing Mossad as an intelligence source do to us?"

leave us better overall intelligence and prevent a needless war with Iran.

Fine, appealing to tradition is a fallacy. Is it mine? Hardly.

Also, I disagree with your glib notions. How would abandoning Israel make it more stable?

Perhaps fundamentalists would have one less reason to point to, but I find it monumentally unlikely they'll forgive us and make amends for something that relatively tertiary.

What is your idea of long term, then? If/when the area falls into even further strife, and some fools decide we need another war to keep the peace. I'd like to know.

Finally, while I won't contend your notions of a needless war with Iran, what makes you say that losing Mossad leaves us better informed? Really, I haven't defended my notions much, but you will have to supply to me better (or any) rationale for why this rather drastic action is reasonable.

>>47

|How would abandoning Israel make it more stable?

this isn't what you asked faggot.  you asked if abandoning Israel would make the area more stable.  even a religionfag like yourself would recognize how peaceful the area would be if the antagonistic minority jewish population left.


|Perhaps fundamentalists would have one less reason to point to, but I find it monumentally unlikely they'll forgive us and make amends for something that relatively tertiary.

Hey look, you got nothing to back it up other than your own biased Jewish outlook.  Besides contradicting your own post, your ignoring peace overtures Arabs always make before getting IDF'd by your fundamentalist thug army.


|If/when the area falls into even further strife, and some fools decide we need another war to keep the peace. I'd like to know.

Anything is better than the status quo.  Since 1973, Israel has cost the United States about $1.6 trillion. If divided by today's population, that is $5000 per person.  sauce: http://www.csmonitor.com/2002/1209/p16s01-wmgn.html


|what makes you say that losing Mossad leaves us better informed?

Mossad has an extremely poor track record in dealing with the Americans.  They were responsible for intelligence in the 1967 war.  Then bombed the USS Liberty, turned around and denied the attack and then tried to convince the United States to nuke Cairo because they claimed Egypt attacked the ship.  Israel joins the company of Vietnam and Iraq in the only countries to purposely attack the US Navy in the past 50 years.  They massacred 1000s of civilians in Lebanon in the 1980s, got America involved and gave us so little intelligence than CIA officers literally got kidnapped because they had to cover for Israel's sloppy work.  They failed to warn Reagan about Beirut, which got over 200 marines killed.  They ignore peace offers by the Palestinians, kill dozens to hundreds of civilian children annually with weapons we give them, and suffer from other crippling forms of operational blindness.  In purposely prolonging the occupation, they are able to collect $5,000,000,000 in direct aid annually for Israel from the US.  Mossad was so critical to US success in the first gulf war, we had to ask Israel not to participate lest the whole coalition fall apart.  Superior Mossad intelligence failed to warn the United States about the first world trade center attack, the infamous "black hawk down" situation in Somalia, the shootings outside the CIA in the late 1990s, the US embassy bombings in Kenya and Tanzania, the attack on the USS Cole, and the second world trade center attack on 9/11.  Superior Mossad intelligence told us Iraq was chock full of WMDs, and immediately after the war tried to get us to attack Syria.  Now these keystone cops want our blood and treasure spilled in a pointless attack on Iran.

With friends like these, who needs enemies?

Now, that wasn't so hard, was it? I even learned something valuable. I'd be even more interested in what you had to say if you'd kindly keep away from ad hominem attacks, asshat.

I misspoke when saying Israel specifically the second time, my point is that the existance of the country, while escalating tensions there, is hardly the largest problem (to me) that faces the Middle East as a region. Furthermore, I have no particular interest in seeing Israel succeed any more than any country besides my own, I'm speaking as a casual observer with a passable knowledge of Israeli history and human nature. I'm taking the view of someone trying to see the advantages to our currently parasitic link to Israel. Say I'm backpedaling if you must; I truly wanted to see if you had anything other than a knee-jerk reaction, I shall cede points based in solid evidence.

If America had the balls to actually bring Israel to task, they'd force them to cede most of what they gained in the Suez Canal Crisis, set aside areas -good areas- for Palestinians, and stop acting like paranoid fucks. The current talks that Israel and Syria are currently engaged in is a damned good start towards solving the latter of those notions; It is much easier to justify being reactionary fundamentalist thugs when virtually every bordering country is either hostile or denies your legitimate existance as a country.

The initial question was why we still ally ourselves with Israel, the answer is generally this: dedication to failed foreign policy, vested interests by Jews, fallacious reasoning, and overall greed.

You ask, with friends like these, who needs enemies?
My question is simply this: Who benefits from this?

>>49
If America had any balls, they'd tell the sandniggers "vae victis," and take back the oil fields that the US discovered, the US developed, and which were US property until the sandniggers seized them in 1973 (and seizure of foreign property has always been recognized as casus belli).

>>50
Now here is a retard with no comprehension of history

>>reactionary fundamentalist thugs
You're talking about Syria, Iran, Iraq, Egypt, and the Palestiniscum here, right?

>>52

no sorry I'm talking about the IDF.  Here's a news article that came out today about jewish soldiers ignoring human rights and shooting women and children.  If you can find a news story similar to this in Egypt, Jordan, Syria, Iran or Palestine, I'd love to see it.  Keep in mind, I just linked a recent story.

If you pay attention, you'd realize this is an almost daily behavior among Israel's finest.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/our-reign-of-terror-by-the-israeli-army-811769.html

>>53

Egyptian police killing 20 unarmed refugees from Darfur: http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/africa/sudanese-refugees-killed-as-egyptian-police-storm-protest-camp-in-cairo-park-521102.html>>53

Palestinians killing their own civilians in the Gaza Civil War:  http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/6663141.stm

Syria's human rights record: http://hrw.org/doc/?t=mideast&c=syria

Iran imprisoning and executing members of minority religions for refusing to renounce their faith: http://info.bahai.org/persecution_iran.html

http://hrw.org/english/docs/2007/10/29/isrlpa17196.htm

Here is a pretty neutral assessment of the Israel/Palestine human rights situation. I agree with this writer pretty much 100%. Israel might cause more civilian deaths than it should, but at least it doesn't go out of its way to target them. Also, note that, unlike the Lebanese, the Israelis did not chase the human rights reporters out of their country with pitchforks and torches when they dared to criticize them.

>>53
lol Eurofag antisemitic propaganda.  Have anything to back that up that doesn't come from Al-Jazeera, Al-Reuters, or Al-BBC?

>>56
Butthurt American lost in his fox-fed delusions.

>>57
...so, "no?"

>>58
Hmm...

Step 1- Ignore reliable information given out by a well-respected broadcast corporation with retarded name-calling
Step 2- Cry about no other source of information, is telling what you don't want to hear

Nice method there, I guess that's how you remain completely oblivious to the world and keep your ancient reactionary notions.

>>59
New ideas are scary to most of these guys. Leave some out for them to sniff at for a while, maybe something will take. If it doesn't, then we are fully justified in ignoring their backwards opinion and moving on with our lives.

>>59 BAWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW HE DOESN'T BELIEVE AL-JAZEERA PROPAGANDA LIKE ALL RIGHT-THINKING SENSITIVE MODERN LIBERALS DO

So... still "no?"

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We've had ties with them for a long time. They're another important base in the Middle East. Having ties with them allows us to balance out groups that are hostile to the U.S. such as Hamas from controlling the region. It's also worthy to note that one of our first free trade agreements was signed with Israel.

Besides perhaps the costs of military aid (which I agree should be reduced), I don't really see any reason for decreasing ties with Israel. We don't need to commit our full, unconditioned support in any situation to Israel (as we don't with any other nation), but Israel is an ally in a region with many countries that are or may become hostile to the US.

>>63

hamas isn't anti-US.  they could have attacked the US 1000 times by now if they were.

Hamas isn't particularly anti US mainly because Israel is in the way. If they didn't have a more urgent situation on their hands, they'd be helping Al-Queda against the US. Not to mention that they are known to be connected to terrorist activity in Europe.

Anyway, I think the US is more worried about Hizballah than Hamas, due to their ties to Iran.

Hamas isn't particularly anti US mainly because Israel is in the way. If they didn't have a more urgent situation on their hands, they'd be helping Al-Queda against the US. Not to mention that they are known to be connected to terrorist activity in Europe.

Anyway, I think the US is more worried about Hizballah than Hamas, due to their ties to Iran.

>>64 Hamas isn't particularly anti US
lolwut

I hate niggers.

Hmm, from what I've read at this link:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel

It appears that we just recognize Israel as a free-state and became allies to further our relations across the Atlantic.

What I find quite suprising is why we continue the relations especially after the Israel-Egypt disaster when one of our communication fleets was deliberately attacked by Israeli helicopters and boats firing torpedoes. Our ship that was attacked barely made it back to port looking like swiss cheese. Later on of course I heard Israel was slaughtering the Egyptians and didn't want America to know anything about it. But than I found out that Egypt was performing some pretty horrific experiments or something like that on children. Might have been some ritualistic practices where the clitoris of the female children is literally cut from the body so when they get older they don't try to get pregnant and disgrace their family name or something to that effect. I'm still not quite sure of any of this, to me it's still just a story until I can get some conclusive material and photos to coincide with these claims.

>>69

Israel didn't purposefully attack the USS Liberty. What would be the motivation of attacking its own ally? The Liberty was attacked because a) an Israeli spyplane pilot that recognized it as American was an idiot and failed to report it to HQ, and b) the captain of the ship was an idiot and chose not to respond to Israeli radio hailing. This was a textbook case of military stupidity and incompetence on both sides, not malice.

As for Israel "slaughtering" the Egyptians? The six day war was in response to the Egyptian navy blockading the Straits of Teheran, blocking off Israel's trade routes. That's an act of war.

BAWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW ARABS

BAAAAAAAWWWWWWWWWWW JEWS

>>71
Why the multiple A's when bawwwwing against kikes?
Kike detected.

>>72
Jews make me cry moar

>>70 |What would be the motivation of attacking its own ally?

The motivation would have been trying to lure the US into the war.  Israel was our ally, and any attack would have "undoubtedly" been the fault of Egypt. 

Israel never hailed the Liberty.  Israel just attacked the ship, repeatedly, targeting it's communications first. After the US lost contact with the ship, we almost attacked Cairo with nukes.  It was only through the efforts of the captain, working doubletime to fix the radio, that this was averted. 

>>74
things like that happen, not everything has to be a conspiracy theory, faggot

jews > you > arabs

>>70
Alright!!! That's what I'm talking about! Research! You did it! Not many people will actually investigate, just like me; but sometimes, putting a little truth in with mostly lies you just might rouste someone to actually perform cohesive research that co-incides or detracts from previous statements!!! HAHA! YES! So we can both agree that the Liberty was attacked by Israel, we can both agree that Israel attacked Egypt, correct? The motives aren't as important as the first primary steps of communication and cooperation; fortunately, my uncle who served in the army happened to get a hold of actual video from the attack on the Liberty. There were US Flags all over the ship, there were constant communiques going out that they were an American Communication ship so there was limited fire power on the ship itself to make room for communications and reconnaissance-based missions. They were sitting ducks! Whether or not Israel was incompitent appears to me like ploy, but that's not important. What is important is the reasons also behind the attacks on Egypt. Egypt actually directly attacked Israel and Israel responded by strategy and took Egypt's capital and showed them the might of their small numbers against Egypt's large numbers but unskilled combatants. It's not conspiracy, it's things that people do that other people get ashamed about and cover up by saying Israel was incompitent and didn't know what they were doing. Yet, they were able to unite, and completely overtake the Egyptian capital and walk away. The attack on the Liberty, realistically, was a deliberate attack to hide what activities were transpiring in Egypt even though it was completely warranted. It was a show of power by force, but had the potential to be misinterpretted as is every form of human conduct. Why do you think the history books you read don't show more real truths, but only what can be reported to the benefit of the reader? Sheesh! Check out "Mr. Wahl's Classroom" You'll find out that a lot of reported history is mostly popular opinion, or what should or shouldn't be reported so that the responder, the reader, will come to a proud understanding as opposed to a very human understanding. Please, continue doing research, do not stop! This is what communiation and cooperation is all about, I'm not always right, but when you have video that shows the happenings during that fateful day, it changes your perspective. I just wish they would declassify certain parts of that mission so I could get my uncle to convert the film into digital and I could release it publically on YouTube. If you feel as though we are always in the RIGHT, the transmitter, person telling the story, might be fabricating much of the information to satisfy the responder. You see it with children, co-workers, friends and family, what makes you think it's any different out there? Yes we are all children, but by being aware of the absolutes of human beings and studying the relativities of each individual, we have the opportunity and a greater potential to learn and become adults. It's a scary but interesting prospect that I barely grasp myself. P.S. Look for common factors or common denominators in everything, these helped me to better understand human nature. We all have brains, we all have different capabilities when using them, we have also come to the point where we can choose whether to listen or ignore. That is the state we are in, but only if you perform research. Good Job, >>70!

>>75

"The evidence was clear. Both Admiral Kidd and I believed with certainty that this attack, which killed 34 American sailors and injured 172 others, was a deliberate effort to sink an American ship and murder its entire crew. Each evening, after hearing testimony all day, we often spoke our private thoughts concerning what we had seen and heard. I recall Admiral Kidd repeatedly referring to the Israeli forces responsible for the attack as 'murderous bastards.' It was our shared belief, based on the documentary evidence and testimony we received first hand, that the Israeli attack was planned and deliberate, and could not possibly have been an accident."

- Captain Ward Boston
JAGC, U.S. Navy

LOL at the Jewpologists who refuse to acknowledge that Israel attacked the USS Liberty.  If Iran had attack that ship in that fashion, we'd have declared war against them ... but since it was done by JEWS, it was forgiven.  It was forgiven since Jews have strong control of the organs of the US government (and media and entertainment and academia).

LOL at the OBVIOUS controllers of the Jewnited Kikes of Jewmerica.  Jews only control America since you limp-wrists allow it to happen.  All the Jews need to do is say "anti-Semite" and they send you scurrying back into your homes in shameful fear.  They control you since you don't have the courage to keep America in majority hands (White European Christians).

>>77
tl;dr