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what is the evolutionary advantage

Name: Anonymous 2008-03-27 5:01

of allergies?

Name: 4tran 2008-03-27 5:56

death

Name: Anonymous 2008-03-27 6:04

Darwinism.

Name: Anonymous 2008-03-27 8:56

imperfect immune system. it has no advantages and is pruned out by death in extreme cases.

Name: Anonymous 2008-03-27 13:00

Lol Panglossianism. >>4 is right.

Name: Anonymous 2008-03-27 13:34

There is no evolutionary advantage because evolution is a lie.
Prove me wrong.

Name: Anonymous 2008-03-27 13:44

>>6
It's true.
Also, did you know that Einstein believed in God?

Name: Anonymous 2008-03-27 14:44

>>6,7
    I hereby declare you the most ignominious creatures I had
the pleasure to read the creative writings of.


>>7

    And your deplorable posts dear, while lacking content,
somehow manage to reflect your repugnant personality, your
uncivilized manners; a sordid, licentious person full of himself.

   Your posts are a soporific drug, as for you sir; A charlatan
with stagnant opinions. Apparently manners where of no
significance to your progenitors.

   As they say; Qualis pater talis filius.

    After reading your post I did sit back and thought
what your point was. Which mysterious power motivated you to
compose such post! Quinon proficit deficit, as such you simply
should do a 180 degrees rotation.

    You may wanted to inspire the reader to do something canonical
in nature; A noble act indeed, however as hypocritious and
pretentious as such act might be. Freedom you say and I repeat.
Such loosely defined abstract concept is anything but reality;
An illusion!

    Ever wondered quis separabit? Dear Ian Curtis (may he rest
in peace) once made such remarkable observasion:
``Love will [..]''.

    Is that so? We may never find out.

Indeed, a conjecture only; The truth appears to be not very
differend. You might want to elaborate on the matter, or at
least satisfy this gluttonous hole devouring my heart;

    Achieve that by answering why your posts are so bletcherous
but please; for the sake of our friendship, do not babble much;
I wish not to be more perplexed than I currently am.

    I stand in awe and await for your response.

Name: Anonymous 2008-03-27 15:15

Einstein didn't believe in god. He was a pantheist.

Name: Anonymous 2008-03-27 15:43

>>8
I bend you to my will.

I am your God.

Name: CSharp !FFI4Mmahuk 2008-03-27 17:23

Things that develop in humans don't have to be advantageous. Remember that thing, oh, MEDICINE? We can treat ourselves. Neanderthals with cystic fibrosis would have died quickly. In the modern human, treatment is available, so the gene stays in the gene pool.

Humans do not follow Mendelian genetics.

Name: Anonymous 2008-03-27 18:16

>>11
Humans do not follow Mendelian genetics.
Non sequitur (that is, the logical fallacy).
Humans are most certainly not immune to natural selection. Modern medicine and technology may have retarded it in some areas, but to claim it's counteracted it completely is complete bullshit.

Name: 4tran 2008-03-27 21:25

>>11,12
There exist a few genetic diseases that are inherently immune to evolution; mortality associated with them occurs in the 40s, which is usually long after procreation.  I can't remember the names of any such diseases, though Huntington's comes to mind, even though the wikipedia description is contrary to what I recall.

>>12
If medecine progresses fast enough, we can bypass evolution completely (genetic engineering lol).  Whether or not that will happen is something I don't know.

Name: CSharp !FFI4Mmahuk 2008-03-27 21:41

>>12
Sapience most certainly does transcend normal Mendelian genetics. There are a precious few things left that drive human genetics toward some attainable advantage.

Name: Anonymous 2008-03-27 21:46

>>13

genetic engineering lol!
lol indeed!

Name: Anonymous 2008-03-28 0:52

>>13
Humans care for their young for very long times. The fact that a disease only kills after procreation does not make it immune to evolution.
See also: the grandmother hypothesis.

Name: Anonymous 2008-03-28 0:54

>>14
You're a fucking moron. Disease still kills. So does cancer. Most pregnancies still end in miscarriage. All of these have genetic components.
The fact that you don't understand evolution for shit does not mean it doesn't happen.

Name: CSharp !FFI4Mmahuk 2008-03-28 1:06

>>17
Uh-huh. So if these diseases kill, why do we still have them? Why are the genes still present when they are obviously disadvantageous?

Oh, because of MEDICINE.

DURRRRR, cockmeister.

Name: CSharp !FFI4Mmahuk 2008-03-28 1:09

>>17
And, besides that, where do I ever say that evolution doesn't take place in humans? All I said was that it's nowhere near as simple as "Oh, well, can't live with this condition, so the species is going to start less of it now." A fucking infant could recognize the difference between the words existence and complexity.

Name: Anonymous 2008-03-28 1:47

>>18
Are you fucking kidding me? Are you seriously trying to say that without medicine, there wouldn't be any lethal diseases? You can't be that fucking dense.

>>19
Incoherent. F-

Name: 4tran 2008-03-28 2:40

>>16
I kinda see what you're saying.  Due to the existance of orphanages and such, parents aren't even necessary for the survival of their young; however, as you stated, having parents around still help.  That assumes, of course, that the parents are actually willing to take care of their children.

>>18
Some of them are completely random, like trisomy 18/21.  These 2 diseases are not inherited (I think), and pop up randomly.

>>20
A -> B
does not make
!A -> !B
true

Name: Anonymous 2008-03-28 10:04

what is the evolutionary advantage of AIDS (injected by gay nigger kock)?

Name: Anonymous 2008-03-28 14:04

>>18
What the fuck is wrong with you? If evolution worked instantly, why do you think evolutionary arms races exist?

``I'm not Superman RIGHT NOW, therefore humans no longer evolve!''

Name: Anonymous 2008-03-28 14:04

>>1

It's a mistery, a flaw in the theory of evolution.

Name: Anonymous 2008-03-28 14:05

ITT straw men about panadaptationism.

Name: CSharp !FFI4Mmahuk 2008-03-28 16:53

>>23
Christ, it's like talking to a goddamn retard.
I'll give you $5 if you can point out the line where I said humans don't evolve.
I'll give you $0 if you can point out the line where I said that human evolution is nowhere near as easy to comprehend as evolution in the wild, you know, since that's what I fucking said.

Nice straw man troll, though, cuntflap.

Name: Anonymous 2008-03-28 17:32

>>26
In that case your original post was wildly off-topic, cocknigger, and trying to claim humans don't evolve according to ``Mendelian genetics'' (whatever you fucking think that means) is still ignorant bullshit.

Name: Anonymous 2008-03-28 19:01

lol "Mendelian genetics"

Yes we do.  Recombination and meiosis occur in people much the same as in pea plants.


Anyhow, as for allergies, they are caused when IgE (an antibody) cross-links FC-epsilon-RI receptors on mast cells, stimulating release of histamines and other effector molecules.  From Immunology, 5e by Coico, Sunshine, and Benjamini:

The Protective Role of IgE.

The protective effects of allergic reactions may be seen in situations where the sensitizing antigen is derived from one of many parasitic worms such a helminthes.  The immune response to these worms favors the induction of IgE.  As a consequence of antigens from the worm cross-linking of IgE on the surface of mast cells (an eosinophils), histamine, and other mediators associated with the anaphylactic response are released.  The effects of increased permeability due to histamine release serve to bring serum components, which include IgG antibody, to the site of worm infestation.  The IgG antibody binds to the surface of the worm and attracts the eosinophils, which have migrated to the area as a result of the chemotactic effects of ECF-A.  The eosinophils then bind to the IgG coated worm, by virtue of their membrane receptors for Fc, and release the contents of their granules (Figs. 14.8 and 14.9)  As noted earlier, eosinophils also express the low-affinity Fc receptor for IgE, which facilitates the binding of these cells to IgE-coated worms.  The major constituent of the contents of the granules released by eosinophils is an MBP, referred to previously, which coats the surface of the worm and lead, in some unknown way, to the death of the worm and its eventual expulsion.  This beneficial effect of the anaphylactic response involving IgE may have evolved to play a role in dealing with worm parasites.

Name: 4tran 2008-03-28 20:31

>>28
You're definitely right that IgE has a protective role, and probably came into existance by evolution.  However, IgE, like all other antibodies, are antigen specific.  When they attack the wrong antigen, then we have allergies.  It is an evolutionary advantage when they attack the right antigens, and a disadvantage when they attack the wrong antigens.

Name: Anonymous 2008-03-29 0:25

When you use bbcode, you assume the role of Internet Experet

Name: Anonymous 2008-03-29 0:25

I mean expert shitting titty fuck fuck

Name: Anonymous 2008-03-29 0:28

[quote]It is an evolutionary advantage when they attack the right antigens[/quote]

lol wut

Name: RedCream 2008-03-29 11:22

I find amusing that people are so woefully uneducated about biology that they think that EVERY biological mechanism has some sort of evolutionary advantage.  Just because an organism has a fit into an environmental niche, doesn't mean that it does so to maximum efficiency.  It fits, it thrives, and it can do all that even with allergies and hemophilia and color blindness.

People who insist on evolutionary reasons for every biological mechanism are just betraying their deep-seated need for a Designer.  In other words, they're closet religifags.  Their WANT for a Designer is so strong that they refuse to comprehend the randomness and lack of purpose built into biological systems.

Name: Anonymous 2008-03-29 11:55

>>33

What's the evolutionary advantage of wanting there to be a Designer?

Name: CSharp !FFI4Mmahuk 2008-03-29 15:42

>>33
Christ, thank you.

THIS is what I was saying. Because humans are much more advanced than other species, not everything that takes place is a result of traditional evolution. We have disrupted its natural process within ourselves in many cases. YES, it still takes place. I never said it didn't. All I said was that it's not even close to the same mechanism because of our own interventions.

Name: Anonymous 2008-03-29 17:48

>>35
That may have been what you thought you were saying, but that's mischaracterising what RedCream said, who, for once, isn't full of shit. And, of course, it's just wrong.

Name: Anonymous 2008-03-30 18:07

>>35

Man, your full of AIDS!

What have we disrtupted?

Name: CSharp !FFI4Mmahuk 2008-03-30 19:04

>>36
No. No, it's not. You don't see peanut allergies running rampant in the wild, do you? We have enough sense not to go frolicking in peanut fields, and if we decide to, we bring fucking EpiPens.

Troll score: 0/10

Name: 4tran 2008-03-30 20:57

>>38
RedCream is saying ~ "evolution is not perfect, not everything has a reason"
You're saying ~ "humans can disrupt evolution with medicine"

I don't call that the same thing...

Name: CSharp !FFI4Mmahuk 2008-03-30 21:16

>>39
>they think that EVERY biological mechanism has some sort of evolutionary advantage.
My point is simply that medicine is one of the main reasons our species has traits that would seem very disadvantageous from an evolutionary standpoint.

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