Deal with it, faggots. Mobile and server platforms are the future. We need to do more with less hardware. C++11 is efficient--and just as easy to write as other modern languages. C# is the way to go for general purpose desktop application programming.
Enjoy your shitty Lisp, C, Haskell, and generally trying to look hardcore, though.
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Anonymous2012-05-06 2:38
C++ has outstandingly complicated grammar. "Outstandingly" should be interpreted literally, because all popular languages have context-free (or "nearly" context-free) grammars, while C++ has undecidable grammar. If you like compilers and parsers, you probably know what this means. If you're not into this kind of thing, there's a simple example showing the problem with parsing C++: is AA BB(CC); an object definition or a function declaration? It turns out that the answer depends heavily on the code before the statement - the "context". This shows (on an intuitive level) that the C++ grammar is quite context-sensitive.
In practice, this means three things. First, C++ compiles slowly (the complexity takes time to deal with). Second, when it doesn't compile, the error messages are frequently incomprehensible (the smallest error which a human reader wouldn't notice completely confuses the compiler). And three, parsing C++ right is very hard, so different compilers will interpret it differently, and tools like debuggers and IDEs periodically get awfully confused.
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Anonymous2012-05-06 2:45
>>1 Mobile and server platforms are the future.
how many web programmers do you know use C++ as a server-side web programming language? go back to reddit and take your Sutter bable with you
I like C++, but wtf? You're just hyped. Let it go, d00d.
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Anonymous2012-05-06 2:52
>>3
The implication was application servers and other non-web uses. Not web frameworks. For server-side web programming, I'd recommend ASP.NET. Why? http://www.wrensoft.com/zoom/benchmarks.html
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Anonymous2012-05-06 2:53
>>2 AA BB(CC); an object definition or a function declaration? It turns out that the answer depends heavily on the code before the statement
wrong. a function definition will have types along with the argument names, and object instantiation wont
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Anonymous2012-05-06 2:57
>>5
>The implication was application servers and other non-web uses.
application server? a server for non-web use, lol that is full retard
a server by definition serves requests on a network dumbfuck, it doesnt matter if its LAN or WAN, a network is a network
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Anonymous2012-05-06 3:19
>>7 >>3-san said: how many web programmers do you know use C++ as a server-side web programming language?
Unless you mean to imply all servers are web servers (in which case you're a fucking retard), >>5 still stands.
SEPPLES samefagstorm much? I guess its that time of the /prog/ menstrual cycle.
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Anonymous2012-05-06 10:57
>>18 implying sending and receiving requests are the most critical things an application server ever does
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Anonymous2012-05-06 12:13
C + +是狗屎
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Anonymous2012-05-06 17:27
http://www.paulgraham.com/avg.html
Don't mind me using lisp and have a huge advantage over your fagstorm shit applications that take extensive time to make and break easiky
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Anonymous2012-05-06 18:01
>>22
Too bad Common Lisp is terrible when it comes to being crossplatform (believe it or not, the majority of people don't use lunix!) and Scheme is utter shit.
Don't even get me started on the packages. And this is coming from a Lisper. You stupid faggots need to realize the weaknesses of your language and work to solve those problems. Otherwise Lisp is dead.
>>20
keep digging, sooner or later you'll come up with an excuse to cover over your lack of knowledge
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Anonymous2012-05-06 21:12
>>22 that take extensive time to make and break easiky [sic]
You still think C++ is where it was 10+ years ago. It has evolved. I can write C++ programs faster than I can write in Java, Lisp, etc., and still harness the power of C++. shared_ptr<> and unique_ptr<> make "C++ programs break easily" a thing of the past.
>>1 Enjoy your shitty Lisp, C, Haskell, and generally trying to look hardcore, though.
No one uses Lisp or Haskell in an attempt to look hard core. C programmers, maybe.
>>26 You still think C++ is where it was 10+ years ago. It has evolved. I can write C++ programs faster than I can write in Java, Lisp, etc.
It hasn't evolved much. Sounds to me like you've just learned a handful of new shit in C++11 and are blissfully unaware of anything else. Your troll won't work on me, though, because while it was at least good enough to get a reply, I will not educate you.
>>30
That may be true for your toy programs, but other people work on projects that are maintained by more than one person. I'm sick of being asked to write Sepples or Java or Perl just because some Redditor thought it was a good choice of language.
>>31
Ok, I see your point. However, (note: directed towards OP) people shouldn't shove opinions on which one is best. As long as it works for everyone, and isn't some unworkable language (see: LOLCODE)it really doesn't matter.
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Anonymous2012-05-07 16:58
>>35
It does matter -- if it ain't Lisp-minus-sexprs, it's crap.
C and C++ are both religions that people follow blindly. Both languages were designed as systems programming languages, the fact that they became popular has only to do with the popularisation of *nix operating systems. There is no reason to use either C or C++ for non-systems programming applications. Despite the hype floating around, C and C++ are not significantly faster than other compiled languages like D, Delphi or Ada. People buy into Herb Sutters spiel that there are only two kinds of languages: "managed languages" (ie Java, C#) and compiled languages of which there is only C and C++.
>>39 People buy into Herb Sutters spiel that there are only two kinds of languages
Wow. I find that reasoning amazing and I cannot agree with it.
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Anonymous2012-05-08 10:52
>>39 C and C++ are not significantly faster than other compiled languages like D, Delphi or Ada
Yes, it is, because there are more mature optimizing compilers for C and C++ than for any of those shitty languages. And C++ is a modern and widely used language. It will be the primary interface to WinRT.
>>30
I care a great deal about what programming language people use. There's a good chance someone like me (a good programmer) will end up maintaining the horse shit that you (a bad programmer) wrote. So knock it off with the fucking Java and C# and learn how to write code.
>>41 because there are more mature optimizing compilers for C and C++ than for any of those shitty languages.
thats a piss poor excuse for using a language, just because more compilers are made for a language, that is no reason to use that language. If people used the best language instead of the most popular languages, commercial software wouldnt be so bug ridden and crash prone as it is now.
and explain to me why I cannot leverage all of those compilers for C and C++ by writing a compiler that compiles language X to C?
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Anonymous2012-05-09 0:11
>>44
you have no idea what youre talking about, Im not even going to explain why thats so stupid because /prog/ is getting a retard overload and Im tired of teaching CS preschool
we get it you are tired of being called out. Get used to it. It's really not that big of a deal.
There are times where compilation to C isn't ideal. One example is getting tail recursion. You can't just use conventional c function calling if you want guaranteed tail recursion, when it is not known which back end standard compliant c compiler is used for the second compilation.
But it can be a very good choice for high performance, portability, and even incorporating with other projects written in C. It opens up a lot of possibilities.