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Ada

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-03 16:48

just discovered this language (Ada) and am thinking of learning it, it looks like it would be a very good language to make some small projects

what does /prog/ think?

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-03 17:27

Go for it.

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-03 17:38

pros and cons pls?

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-03 17:45

>>3
Pros:
* It's not another C++ or Java.
* Teaches creative thinking.
Cons:

                                        (3 4)
                                          │
                                          │
                                          ▼
((1 2) 3 4)┏━━━┳━━━┓                  ┏━━━┳━━━┓    ┏━━━┳━━━┓
      ────►┃ ● ┃ ●─╂─────────────────►┃ ● ┃ ●─╂───►┃ ● ┃ ╱ ┃
           ┗━┿━┻━━━┛                  ┗━┿━┻━━━┛    ┗━┿━┻━━━┛
             │                          │            │
             ▼                          ▼            ▼
   (1 2)   ┏━━━┳━━━┓    ┏━━━┳━━━┓     ┏━━━┓        ┏━━━┓
      ────►┃ ● ┃ ●─╂───►┃ ● ┃ ╱ ┃     ┃ 3 ┃        ┃ 4 ┃
           ┗━┿━┻━━━┛    ┗━┿━┻━━━┛     ┗━━━┛        ┗━━━┛
             │            │
             ▼            ▼
           ┏━━━┓        ┏━━━┓ 
           ┃ 1 ┃        ┃ 2 ┃
           ┗━━━┛        ┗━━━┛

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-03 17:50

>>4
The cons cells are fabulous  щ(ಭ_ಭ)μ

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-03 17:56

>>4
What thew hell am I reading?

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-03 18:24

>>4
Pros:
It gets you out of my hair.

Cons:
You still bumped this thread. Goddamn.

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-03 18:26

>>4 I LOVE YOU! I LOVE YOUR POST! I READ IT 5 TIMES! KEEP POSTING!

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-03 18:27

>>4

This looks like shit in firefox. I figured your spacing was just fucked up, so I loaded it into Notepad++ and started looking through fonts, trying to find one that would display all of those unicode characters.

I finally found one, DejaVu Sans Mono, and, for whatever reason, it displayed your diagram perfectly, with no spacing problems. Other monospaced fonts, it was all fucked up.

What the hell's going on here? A monospaced font is a monospaced font. Why, then, is DejaVu Sans Mono the only font that shows this diagram properly?

I'm so fucking confused.

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-03 18:35

>>9
Many mono fonts aren't completely monospaced. All the fonts I have with 'mono' in the name show it fine though.

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-03 18:35

>>9
looks fine to me and I was using the default monospace.

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-03 18:48

>>11
It don't work for me.

>>9
The font characters are all the same size.  The whitespace characters are a different size, however.

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-03 19:24

>>4
Why is this a con? A linked list is a linked list is a linked list in any language.

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-03 19:25

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-03 20:27

>>13
You don't deserve /prog/.  Get out.

Name: >>11 2010-04-03 20:46

>>12
Really? It even looks fine in a default install of Seamonkey

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-03 21:00

>>16
It'll probably look find on most Linux distributions without any messing around. Just don't install the MS fonts.

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-03 22:03

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-03 22:16

>>18
fucking awesome thanks

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-03 23:03

Ada Tutor is the best interactive tutorial you will find
www.adatutor.com
for learning Ada

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-03 23:28

Ada is this weird Martian version of Pascal that also reminds me of Haskell in many ways. I'm pretty sure it's only useful for writing harmless lies functions.

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-03 23:43

>Ada is this weird Martian version of Pascal that also reminds me of Haskell in many ways.

the reason Ada reminds you of Haskell is that it has very strong type checking. Ada has a lot of other very special features like it does what the syntax says it will do unlike C/C++ that leaves you guessing what the actual result the syntax will produce. And unlike C# or Java it does not require you to program using OOP nor does it run on a VM.

the choice is yours

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-04 0:04

>>22
C/C++
Okay C++ I can see being ambiguous. But do you really have such a hard time with C?

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-04 0:24

A civil discussion about a programming language? On /prog/?

Well I sure didn't see that one coming.

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-04 1:51

>>24
Half the thread was discussing a BBCODE cons illustration. Civil? perhaps. Useful or interesting? Nope.

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-04 2:01

I'm pretty sure it's only useful for writing harmless lies functions.
( ≖‿≖)

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-04 4:39

>>6
Figure 2.5:  Structure formed by (cons (list 1 2) (list 3 4)).

Read your SICP.

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-04 6:10

>>Okay C++ I can see being ambiguous. But do you really have such a hard time with C?

You cant even rely on IO functions to work in C. And keeping track of pointers and memory management in C is simply beyond what is humanly possible after a certain point. C is high level assembly language.

Ada is the exact opposite of C, instead of protecting the programmer by running on a VM like C# or Java, Ada is a compiled language that goes out of its way to be correct and save the programmer hours of wasted debugging time by producing code that is proven correct from the beginning.

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-04 6:49

And keeping track of pointers and memory management in C is simply beyond what is humanly possible after a certain point.
A certain point of bad design, but yes, I can see how the same subpar programmers would be sitting there with a mess that they couldn't get to compile at all, rather than a mess that crashed a lot.

code that is proven correct
Hah.

Name: >>23 2010-04-04 12:15

>>28
I'd argue, but none of the points you made have anything to do with syntax.

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-04 13:26

>>28
Ada is a compiled language that goes out of its way to be correct and save the programmer hours of wasted debugging time by producing code that is proven correct from the beginning
I had to write a couple of assignments in Ada in freshman year. You practically have to "prove it correct" by hand with all the verbose type system and control structure syntax (though it's still better than Java).

I would rather use a language where the compiler at least makes an effort to help you. There's no call for something as obnoxious or exotic as Haskell, but it would at least be nice to have an Ada-like language with type inference and lighter syntax.

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-04 13:59

>>31
type inference
I was going to troll you, but then I realized that every serious language designer is a fan of type inference these days, especially the ones who work on "systems" languages intended to replace C and Sepples. And then I cried T_T

Name: >>94 2010-04-04 14:09

>>31
it would be nice
I bet you're the same fucking douchebag who wanted modules in C a while back.

I'm stalking you and making a shrine out of your posts, teehee c:

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-04 14:43

>>29
A design that bad is obtained merely by programming in C. Any time you've got to worry about who owns some data so you can decide who deallocates it, you've fucked up in the design phase. And no, copying does not count as a solution. Way to introduce wasteful computation that removes any speed advantage C might have had.

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-04 15:01

the main reason for Ada not becoming mainstream is that there are not many books that teach Ada at a beginners level. Most of the books out there are very expensive, are obscure and go out of print quickly.

O'Reilly has not made any book on Ada, which is a shame because there is a real need for a highly reliable language in systems and embedded programming as well as general use.

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-04 15:26

>>34
A lot of C programmers (and really, most other programmers as well) don't seem to understand that in a language like C with manual allocation, it is extremely important to design the control flow of your program around the allocation scheme.

Ideally you should allocate all the memory you'll ever need at the earliest possible point in your program, and never touch malloc() again. Even if you can't do that, there are still a number of schemes for keeping track of all the chunks of memory you've allocated. Most of these break in recklessly concurrent programs, so you have to be very strict in treating multiple threads like intercommunicating processes.

If none of this is possible (such as when using an OS-facing event-driven API) then you should be using a garbage collector. Waving your manually allocated e-penis around in a harsh environment like that will just get it chopped off.

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-04 15:52

>>34
So you're a bad C programmer. That's been established long ago. Who cares? The rest of us don't insist on making the mistakes you do.

>>36
design the control flow of your program around the allocation scheme.
Okay, you're worse than >>34.

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-04 15:58

>>36
Ideally you should allocate all the memory you'll ever need at the earliest possible point in your program, and never touch malloc() again.

Also, you should NEVER use strings longer than 128 characters. These don't exist in a righteous program, period. These are inventions of non-programmers, of managers and synergy-crazy CEOs, are a form of blasphemy and an insult against God. So add #define sprintf(s, ...) snprintf(s, 128, ...) to your 'void.h' and be free hackers, you be free.

Some youngun might as an experienced C hacker: but what should I do if I want to compose an SQL request? My friends, the rule of thumb is: if it requires more than 128 characters, then it's a Devil's work and you should avoid it, like you avoid non-Free software. SQL does indeed require longer strings often -- and is loved by managers and CEOs in the Enterprise, what more do you need to know about it to come to a definite conclusion?

Plain text files are a perfectly good NoSQL solution.

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-04 16:03

>>38
You're trolling efforts our pretty weak, amigo. This isn't about good or evil, though. Thank you for playing.

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-04 16:06

>>38
writing SQL in a C program
I love you. I love your post. I read it five times. But I'm trying to be subtle about it.

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-04 16:12

Plain text files are a perfectly good NoSQL solution.
Implying you can't use SQL with text files

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-04 16:14

>>40
Many C programs use SQLite.

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-04 16:17

>>36
design the control flow of your program around the allocation scheme
You're clearly not a very experienced programmer.  The reason we have tools like Valgrind is to rely on those, and not some hare-brained Martian/Spanish control flow design, to locate and plug our memory leaks.  The true master of control flow is obviously the algorithm itself.

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-04 16:27

>>41
Of course not, but it is not required. Many people don't understand such subtle distinctions and believe, for example, that it is forbidden to sell Free software. It is understandable mistake, after all proprietary software licenses forbid sharing and Free software is often perceived as "opposite" to proprietary, so people expect it to forbid something else. Our task is to explain that Free software is focused on four individual Freedoms and allows you doing absolutely anything, even using it with combination with anti-Freedom technologies.

In much the same way you can use SQL with plaintext files. But you'd be much better using them in the intended NoSQL fashion, leisurely scaling in the cloud, mapping and reducing, with effortless replication and hot schemales.

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-04 16:31

>>36
That's like saying you should design your car around the transmission system. It's obviously false. You design the rest of the car first, and then you use a transmission that accommodates your needs.

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-04 16:44

The sorry state of modern software development is because of people like >>45-sama, who honestly believes that you can design your car around the radiator grill shape, colour and marketing slogans, slapping on the "suitable" transmission, engine and frame almost as an afterthought. Metaphorically speaking.

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-04 16:52

>>45,46
You're both arguing a false analogy.

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-04 17:29

>>45
You design the rest of the car first
U MENA THE CDR

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-04 17:41

My other Ferrari is a Fdrrdrd

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-04 18:38

>>48
Back to /idiots/, please.

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-04 20:37

>>49
My other Ferrari is a Fdrrdrd
It reminds me of that Italian or Spanish guy, who was a mechanic, then went to WW2, and on his return established a business building tractors out of leftover military hardware from the war effort. Long story short, he is rich as hell and buying various luxury cars, including Ferrari's.

Then he calls the Ferrari manufacturers and says that their cars are too loud, they do sound as "Fdrrdrd", and the asshole on the other end replies, oh, look who's talking, a tractor manufacturer, I bet your other car is cddrddrddr, why won't you make a car yourself if you're so clever. So Ferruccio Lamborghini hung up, sweared aloud, got his shit together and made a car he liked.

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-04 20:54

* Fdrrdccdd Ldmbdrghdnd

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-04 21:07

>>50-san is just mad because he didn't think of it first

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-04 21:42

>>51
or Spanish guy
Ferruccio Lamborghini

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-04 22:27

>>54
Ferruxio Lamborgxini?

Sorry, my heart's just not in it.

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-04 22:35

Witty discourse but posts without any content?

Only on prague

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-04 23:12

>>56
It's because we subsume /lang/.

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-05 13:38

…………………...„„-~^^~„-„„_
………………„-^*'' : : „'' : : : : *-„
…………..„-* : : :„„--/ : : : : : : : '\
…………./ : : „-* . .| : : : : : : : : '|
……….../ : „-* . . . | : : : : : : : : |
………...\„-* . . . . .| : : : : : : : :'|
……….../ . . . . . . '| : : : : : : : :|
……..../ . . . . . . . .'\ : : : : : : : |
……../ . . . . . . . . . .\ : : : : : : :|
……./ . . . . . . . . . . . '\ : : : : : /
….../ . . . . . . . . . . . . . *-„„„„-*'
….'/ . . . . . . . . . . . . . . '|
…/ . . . . . . . ./ . . . . . . .|
../ . . . . . . . .'/ . . . . . . .'|
./ . . . . . . . . / . . . . . . .'|
'/ . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .'|
'| . . . . . \ . . . . . . . . . .|
'| . . . . . . \„_^- „ . . . . .'|
'| . . . . . . . . .'\ .\ ./ '/ . |
| .\ . . . . . . . . . \ .'' / . '|
| . . . . . . . . . . / .'/ . . .|
| . . . . . . .| . . / ./ ./ . .|

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-05 13:55

Fdri Lambdaghini

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-05 13:59

>>59
ooo I like that one

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-06 8:52

ADA BUMP

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-06 11:23

>>62
  It looks like you have Adblock or other ad blocking software enabled. In order to keep the content of this website free we must display advertisements on it. If you want to view the content of this website the author wishes that you disable Adblock or any other ad blocking software you may have before browsing the website. This message will go away once the software is disabled and you press the "Back" button.

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-07 19:41

>>18
OP I have a lot of Ada ebooks I can upload for you if you want me to.
Hey dude, I'd love to see these.

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-08 14:04

>>65
this*

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-08 14:06

>>66
those**

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-08 15:05

>>67
African American***

Oops, wrong thread!

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-08 15:24

>>68
* ^*

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-08 16:31

>>69
* -> (* -> *) -> *

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-08 17:01

>>70
Well, duh.

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-08 18:36

>>67
>>68
>>69
>>70
only on /prog/

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-08 19:13

>>70
flip StateT

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-08 19:16

>>72
You missed one (two actually). I'm impressed by your choice of the ENTERPRISE style over the EXPERT reply styles.

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-08 19:19

>>73
s/StateT/ListT/, since :k StateT => * -> (* -> *) -> * -> *

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-08 21:15

>>72

Please be a good citizen and optimize.

>>67-70

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-11 0:43

so no eboks?

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-11 12:18

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-11 12:19

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-11 12:55

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-11 18:26

>>80
I clicked.

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-11 18:28

>>80
why the hell does my ISP give me formatted server-not-found errors?

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-11 18:35

>>82
Because they're in violation of Rule #34.

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-11 22:14

>>82
DNS hijacking. Use a non-shit DNS server.

Name: not >>82 2010-04-11 23:23

>>83
Mine's 127.0.0.11 for that very reason.
___________________________________________________________
1. two things I know already: 1) 8.8.8.8, etc. and 2) using localhost for DNS is bad.

Name: >>85 2010-04-11 23:25

Bah. >>83 should be >>84

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-12 1:28

2) using localhost for DNS is bad.
Explanation.

I use dnsmasq to (among a couple other tricks) provide names for all the systems on my home network, so on the system that's running the dnsmasq server my dns is pointing to 127.0.0.1. Not sure how else you expect to do that kind of thing.

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-12 4:24

>>85
And by 127.0.0.1 you mean warez.satanic.net, right?

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-12 5:27

My other Ada is a [spoiler]Ddd[/spoiler].

Name: Anonymous 2010-04-12 8:56

>>87
It's really only a faux-pas for pedantic network admins.

Name: Anonymous 2011-02-04 15:26

Don't change these.
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