College Advice

For those of you who have actually worked in the field, what kind of suggestions or advice could you give to a college freshman going into Computer Science? Things to do in spare time, what's important to learn and what isn't, fields to look into, etc etc, whatever you find relevant.

(P.S. My college teaches C, I've been programming since high school, and I have been reading SICP)

Avoid Java and the like

Keep reading SICP and TaoCP and other theoretical bullshit books. They'll help. Integrate more 'enterprisey' books into your diet too. Also, K&R.

>>1
When you finally get into the real world you will more often than not end up patching / adding onto someone elses poorly coded shite. Rarely will there be chances to start new projects.

>>4
Rarely will there be chances to start new projects.

...and even if there is, they'll be coded in some buzzword-bullshit language like Ruby-on-rails because upper management heard about it on the "Web 2.0".

>>1
My advice is to just give up and take Maths or something, Computer Science is pretty much a road to failure and heartache. Unless you have no qualms about being a 9-5 shit pay code monkey.

>>6

Really? I've heard good things about Software Engineering and other fields from http://www.bls.gov/oco/home.htm and other such places, they seem to make good money and there is a large demand. Or I guess I could take a job as an Administrator (like SysAdmin or DBA) if that doesn't work out. It seemed like a safe career choice.

Besides, wtf else am I going to do? What would a degree in Mathematics get me instead? Or is there some other career path that I should look into that I may have overlooked (like plumbing or woodworking or doing something else with my hands)?

Is Computer Science as a career really that drull? I mean, I plan on getting my Masters so I would figure that would help (BS/MS program). I should be able to find a way to stay away from the In-House Software programming that sucks the souls out of people in big corporations, no?

>>7
India has killed programming. Enjoy your outsourcing and VB.net

>>7
If you do go into software engineering, remember to also do plenty of design etc. courses. Being a code monkey in a megacorporation of today is pretty grim, but being a software designer or particularly an analyst isn't quite as much so. Also the pay will be higher.

Or you could just punt and go for a MBA. That always pays off, long as you can keep snorting the bolivian marching powder.

>>8

Mediocre ANTICUDDER who sucks so much at programming and has so little [spoiler]SATORI[/satori] that he was outperformed by an middle-school-educated Indian working for $4/hr in a noisy, poorly ventilated factory with no breaks and long shifts.

>>10 here. Oh god curse my dyslexia.

>>10
>>11
EXPERT BBCODE PROGRAMMER

>>8
>>9

>>7 here. Software Engineering just looked good from what I've read and what has been said about the need for them. There's a difference between a Programmer and a Software Engineer, try looking around the bureau of labor services website they have some pretty good information around there.

Also, what do you guys think of administrative work (SysAdmin, Database Administrator, Network Administrator)? From what I've heard, SysAdmin is something I'd *love* to do but it seems like it's getting all automated and outsourced, while I'm really interested in DBA due to its apparent job security and high pay and even fairly easy work even though many would view it as incredibly boring, and I don't really know a whole lot about Network Administration except that I believe it deals more with hardware/wires which I could probably do but don't really care about (i prefer software over hardware, thus why im not in Electrical Engineering).

Also, I've been really interested in Security for awhile now, although I don't think I can make any decisions in that area until I get through all my calculus and see if I can eventually deal with Differential Equations. DBA is nice since it should let me at least dabble a bit in that. Ethical Hacking looks awesome but I have no idea how to get into it or what's it all about, any information on anything in the way of Cyber Security would be great.

Thanks /prog/ :D

>>1
If you aren't already spending your free time writing code, GTFO of software engineering.  You will be hated as dead weight and will never progress, since you will be always be bumped by those who have a drive for software and didn't just get into the industry because it "looked good".

Do get into sysadmin, DBA, etc, if you like being meticulous and can be thorough, responsible, and continually self-learning at a reasonable pace.  Those are things that can be learned and don't involve a lust for creativity.

Are you going to a public uni? If so, my advice would be to learn how C++ relates to a gas pump. Now, go get your cert at a private institution and leverage your talents to one field of programming that will inevitably be left behind for bullshit like SilverLight.


!\Enjoy your PHP

>>14

Yes, of course, because there are [b]SO[/b] many smart, hard working Software Engineers, amirite? So much high-quality in this industry.
Sorry, I forgot my sarcasm tags at home today...

Seriously though, I like the idea of SE because of the creativity it allows for. I'm actually smart enough to do the work and learn the material, which should be more than enough to be able to do good work once I actually get to *work* in the field rather than just doing my own little dinky projects at such an early stage in my career. I learn about things like shell scripting and the like to make my life easier for specific purposes though, sure.

Just because I don't spend all of my free time hobbled up in a room writing code doesn't mean I'm automatically out of the Software Engineering field. Sorry if I actually have a life to go along with my profession.

>>15

how C++ relates to a gas pump? Srry, i don't get it... -_-

Yes, I do go to one of the Universities of our great 50 states, but the one I go to has enough prestige to make it worth it (compared to a crappy state college or what have you), and the curriculum is better than many private schools. Regardless of what else they do and offer, they teach C for all of the core classes (except for C++ for one class to teach OO crap, which is reasonable at least considering it's something we'll all come across at some point eventually), which means a lot.

My uni is one of the 100 best, and with the education the provide and the courses i will get to learn from in their curriculum, I believe I should have the base to do really anything I'd want to do in the field. I won't be stuck in one crappy area with low skill that has a high probability of being outsourced (protip: it's the low-skill low-creativity jobs that are being outsourced. If you are smart and have an actual education to back you up, you job WON'T GET FUQIN OUTSOURCED).

The real question is, what? What opportunities do I have, and what's good?

>>16
BBCODE FAILURE

>>16
Protip: If you want to get into SE then you will be programming in either C++ or Java. No exceptions. You do realize that today Software Engineering is pretty much all OO, right? I'd say that your University needs to play catch up if all they're doing is teaching C. I suggest reading up on the Rational Unified Process and UML to get an idea of how SE is like.

>>18

Really? *just* C++ or Java? Man, that sucks... What the hell are the other really great programming languages like Python used for then?

Also, we learn C and C++ here, so they do teach OO stuff (even though I already know it from previous learning before college). It's the core though, so after getting through the 4 core courses you can choose courses that let you specialize. My university in no way needs to "catch up", I would be more inclined to think other schools have fallen behind by going to JavaSchool path. The Abstract Bullshite is what's important in college, after you have the foundation you can do whatever crap language you need to since the language shouldn't matter anyways, right?

>>19
LOL Python

>>19

ONE WORD

>>21
That's what I would say.

>>20-22

ITT: C and LISP are the only languages you can ever program in. Everything else is shit.

NO EXCEPTIONS

PROVE ME WRONG

>>23
Smalltalk is pretty cool.

>>19
What the hell are ... Python used for then?
Mainly small toy applications and cgi scripts.

So uh...

Anyone care to give any advice to a lowly college freshman? Learning C for the abstract bullshite (as well as some C++ to teach OO, but i've already learned that shit in high school with Java so meh), but outside of that what courses (or just subjects) should I look out for to take? (or maybe look out for to *avoid*?)

>>26 here

just wanted to add... I know we all joke about Java, but is it actually worth getting really good at programming with and becoming a sort of "expert" on for jobs? I already know a lot of the basics of it, I'm wondering if I should further my knowledge of it

>>27
OO is good to know, and Java is obsessed with it and only it.  Go for it.  It will teach you code organization skills and API design.

>>27
WHO THE FUCK IS JOKING ABOUT JAVA?

>>27
No. There are no experts in Java. The language is too dumbed down and bloated to have experts. Choose a better language like Haskell or C++ (I say C++ not because it's a good language, but rather, it has so many weird fucking esoteric quirks which provide a niche for the ``expert'' to latch onto).

>>30
Go back to bed Bjarne

If Java is so dumbed-down and bloated, and C++ is so bad, why are all the major software projects these days apparently using them?

Also, when I say "expert of Java" i mostly just mean get good enough at it and know enough of what I can do with it so that I can write better code than other Java programmers. One of the things I'm hoping learning C and reading SICP/TAOCP will help me with

>>32
Because the people picking the languages are dumb and probably bloated.

>>33

I mean, is it a thing with Management being retarded and believing the "hype"? Are there actually some good companies out there using another language to make their projects, so it would be better for me to learn whatever language that is so I can work on and create better projects/software?

Or is there another reason for why the OO languages are so popular and widely used? They can still make good software, right?

>>32 People don't know better

>>34
Actually, most places that actually matter, such as banks, as opposed to the abundance of ENTERPRISES, which is where most programmers are heading, still use languages like COBOL.

>>36

Isn't COBOL a crappy Legacy language (thus why banks use them)?

>>34
You shouldn't confuse Sepples and Java with OO.

!ITT: people who program for a living.

>>39
How would you know that, if (by your own admission) you don't program for a living?

>>1

When you are done reading SICP, read "Computer Architecture: A Quantitative Approach", by Hennessy and Patterson.

write a full-system simulator too

>>40
And so life imitates art.

maybe i'll just get an administrator job so I don't have to worry about any of this shit anymore...

>>42
This might surprise you, but I invented that meme.

>>44
This may surprise you, but I invented that meme.

Surprise may meme me, but this invented you

than just to make a program that   is waiting to   be executed getLine.