Souls and God

Now I haven't read much about logic or stuff so if someone could formulate my problem with a better language I'd be thrilled.
Let's say God is omniscient.
Because of his omniscience he will only act in one way, seeing how he's because of mentioned omniscience seeing himself act in the future, now and the past.
Now let's take a soul.
God is the creator of all souls, since he is the creator of everything. Which means that he makes a conscious decision when creating a particular soul. Because of his omniscience he will see this souls future before he's even created it, he will see whether or not this soul will sin or not.
Now here comes my point:
If God is truly omniscient, then why does he knowingly create souls that inevitably will sin and revolt against God, thus being condemned to hell?
The way one can explain this is if God's either not:
Omniscient

or

All benevolent

What do you guys think?
Did I think it through this time?

RedCream is a joke anyway

>>39
As long as you admit this "god" thing is just a topic and not something that actually exists, then OK.

After all, divinities are PROVABLY WRONG concepts.  They have such enormous presence attributed to them, that they should be leaving evidence all around the fucking place.  Instead, we have ZERO evidence.  Therefore, they don't fucking exist.

This is the things like religifaggots like >>38 can't tolerate.  Their comfortable little delusion is 100% disproven but they need to continue the charade of belief since it's useful to have millions of fucking MORONS abide by that belief.  Stupidity is a characteristic that inherently lacks self confidence, so it requires validation and company.

>>38 is so fucking indoctrinated and wholly stupid that he can't even tell the difference between a divinity and a creature.  That's the trouble with religifaggotry -- it's so steeped in illogic that there's little point to even discussing its failures except to fucking laugh at it.

So I laugh.  Religitards!  YOU'VE GOT NO FUCKING PROOF AND THAT ALONE DISPROVES YOUR ASSERTIONS.  LOLOLOLOLOL!

>>42
Stop spamming this board with KIKES etc then we'll talk religion.

>>42
You are aware that the need for proof only exists in the scientific view of the world and not in any religious view. They have God's word so proof is irrelevant. I'm afraid you've failed, RedCream. :(

Okay, can we get back to my question?
If there are any Christians here, can you explain this cruel behavior of your (hypothetical redcream, hypothetical) God?

And if you didn't bother reading my two posts, here's an summary:

A. God create all souls.
B. God sees all souls that will suffer damnation before he even created them.
C. Therefore God is consciously creating souls that are determined to sin and consequently be punished in hell.
(D. God may only act in one way because E's already seen all the past, present and future actions by Emself. If E could act in a way other than what E have seen then E has not seen the correct action and is therefore not omniscient.)

>>43
I don't spam this board, assjack.  Now message my cock with your spasmic esophagus.

>>44
The need for proof is not relegated to the "scientific view of the world".  The need for proof is ABSOLUTE.  Take those religifags and tell them they don't require proof in their daily lives, and see how far you fucking get.  "You don't need proof of my ability to repay; just lend me 10 thousand dollars and have faith I'll pay you back."

YOUR STATEMENT IS LUDICROUS.  You stink of FAIL.  Awful FAIL.

The need for proof is ABSOLUTE

Fail. There are many ways of looking at the world where proof is irrelevant. You just, er, religiously believe in the scientific paradigm even though all proof is based on an unprovable set of assumptions in this paradigm.

Take those religifags and tell them they don't require proof in their daily lives

Fail. Daily life =/= an analogy for theories on the existence of God.

ouch RedCream, I really exposed your fail there, sorry about that.

>>47
There are many ways of looking at the world where proof is irrelevant.
U FAIL.  The only way to look at the world without descending into infantile superstitions and other such nonsense, is through evaluating evidence and coming up with conclusions based on those.

You just, er, religiously believe in the scientific paradigm even though all proof is based on an unprovable set of assumptions in this paradigm.
U FAIL.  Science delivers provable results.  These results can be replicated by whomever cares to.  Religion just delivers genocide and other such spectacular sufferings and displays of sophomoric stupidity.

Daily life =/= an analogy for theories on the existence of God.
U FAIL.  Daily life IS living.  You speak of an unlivable reality, which by definition cannot be experienced.

ouch RedCream {...}
You should be saying "ouch", since it only takes about 3 seconds to destroy your so-called arguments.  That's that easy to do since you have already dismissed the need for evidence to decide things -- particularly important things like if a divinity exists.  By dismissing the need for evidence, you're in the realm of fantasy, where it's easy to be wrong since it's all a fucking FICTION PLAY anyway.

You religifreaks are completely stupid.  What I'm doing here isn't much of a feat since a 12-yr-old with basic instruction in logic can PWN you up, down and sideways.  I mean, really:  "proof is irrelevant"?  What kind of fucking immature moron actually believes such stupidity?  Oh yeah, the religitards who hang around other religifucks so as to never encounter the sane people like myself WHO DEMAND PROOF OF OUTRAGEOUS ASSERTIONS LIKE THE EXISTENCE OF A DEITY.

Guys, can we talk about my post instead?

Nanami, here's my axiom for yours,

I believe (stating that I already don't have proof, but I have an idea) that God is of the past, present, and future only because God's All-Encompassing essence is that of potential energy, put that together with endless amounts of opportunity (kinetic energy) and you have what we are consistently seeing today, the effect of the past. But I am not quite convinced of an actual being as of yet, more like a feeling, intuition if you will. End Axiom
The point that RedCream fails to make time and time again, is that we must seperate and define the different aspects of memory, imagination, observation, recollection, time, and pretty much everything before we actually begin to unify it. But, then again, even I have the potential to be wrong, as do we all...RedCream is no exception to this life-rule. Therefore, let's be wrong, and realize we are wrong, and have the good sense to be less-wrong. :) RedCream, you're failure is at hand. You have been warned, now you know, and knowing is half the battle.

>>48
...

Terrible. You fail to realize that this "proof" you speak of is necessarily based on a set of unprovable assumptions just like any other religious view.

Science is just another religion because it relies on the existence of an unprovable Truth, that being: Observable phenomena is the be all and end all of reality and what we observe must exist in the way we observe it objectively of our perceptions and learned interpretations.

Your ranting about how proof is OBVIOUSLY important when it comes to matters more complicated than social interactions coupled with your failure to explain WHY it is important in these scenarios and your insulting of those who disagree with you makes you sound like a typical brainwashed-by-dogma religious freak.

Yow! Boy redcream you're sure getting slaughtered tonight, perhaps it's time to quit drinking?

Oh, and one more thing, when we (metaphorically) bit into the apple of the tree of knowledge of consequences, we were given the (potential) of being as gods, not the ending result of as gods. Therefore we are fallible, but how can God be infallible? Well, in order to be infallible, everything that is wrong must be made right. So, how do you make something that's wrong (liability) into something right (asset). By utilizing it in a different way. Example: ME, I wasted (liability) 23 years of my life doing nothing, how do I turn that into an asset? By using those 23 lost (liability) years into 23 experience (asset) years. Ok, but what does that mean? It means, those wasted 23 years are my experience in my research to further the thread of human self-awareness, choice, and primarily potential. And this method of turning a liability into an asset is why God is infallible, thus, if we were to continually do this method, we would have a greater potential of be as gods, but we could only be less fallible, not infallible. But why the differentiating talk that I provoke? Well, it's by accident that I stumbled upon a process of old nature that's been lost over the years to obscurity. The Alpha Male vs The Beta Male. Basically, like wolf pack behavior. What defines the Alpha from the Beta? The Alpha believes he is the Beta, therfore strives to become the Alpha and protect what he gains. The Beta belives he is the Alpha, therefore strives to protect his title at any cost. This is just a slight definition, there are better ones out there. Basically if you believe yourself to be infallible, you will lose the need to research. If you believe yourself to be fallible, you will acquire the need to experience that which is only believed. Hence, RedCream's failure is immiment because he is doing all the research and providing us with his (proofs) of his ignorance, to which we can all turn to our advantage and use against him, just put all his words into a clip, load into 50 cal, aim, squeeze the trigger, RedCream goes down.

>>51
YESSSSS!!! That's it exactly!!! Clear and present perceivable observations only exist in the moment, everything else is obscured by imagination or experience unless we record it! Fantastic! You did it! HAhaha! RedCream is failing like a captain shooting holes in his own ship with a cannon! HEHEHEHE! *does it hurt? does it hurt?*

Nanami, perhaps, if I could understand your point of view a bit more clearly perhaps I might be able to add to your own axioms, but as far as proofs or paradoxes to be had from such a venture, would really be waste of your own time. You won't be enlightened here, only gain more axioms wanting to be proved.
All I'm saying is that perhaps, you believe that your axiom of all of God's aspects is a liability to you because you can't prove them as of yet. But what if you use that liability to your advantage and look for similar aspects amongst everything after you study everything. Everything meaning what you are interested in. I know it's no answer and definitely not the one you want, but this 4chan.org forum is like church, it only reinforces the axiom, not exploration for the paradox. I do understand if you are disappointed, but remember, the choice is yours, accept what we say as a liability or turn it to your advantage (asset). The choice of that, I leave to you.

Sometimes you will see scientists go back to their axioms to see if maybe they can repose other questions. This is a methodology known as "guess and check, or trial and error". Something that RedCream consistently fails to do, he just accepts what other so-called professionals tell him, but he never wants to live his own life, hence his annoying presence here. He is the antagonist, the perverbial "devil" if you will saying that you don't need to investigate your axiom, you shouldn't have an axiom in the first place, just do what you feel like doing for the moment. Well, that's what animals do, not out of choice, only out of their own nature. So, RedCream would have us behave as animals without any shred of Will, choice, or imagination. Thanks for your compassion RedCream. We do so vigorously appreciate it, as it only reaffirms our own faith. Without knowing of the possibility of you, we wouldn't have the opportunity to choose a different potential. (to know that a potential like you exists, allows us to understand other choices and make them accordingly)

Ah, Nanami!!! I think I see the problem. It's your final statement at the closing:

"The way one can explain this is if God's either not:
Omniscient

or

All benevolent"

You are looking for a specific answer that fits your idea. And that's why you won't find what you're looking for here or anywhere for that matter. Leave wide open the potential for discovery of unknown matters, you'll be even more suprised when they occur, and more fulfilled when they do. If not, you'll never see it, even if it's right in front of your eyes. Keep an Open Mind.

Hmm...how to see something as all benevolent when there is potential for malevolence...? hmm, that's a tough question too.

I'll try to be precise about this, cause it's very important as it applies to everything.

It has to do with perception. If you are continually exposed with "Goodness" eventually your perception of "Goodness" is decreased due to exposure and eventually becomes mundane and ceases to retain it's "Goodness". However, if "Goodness" is to retain it's "Goodness" in your perception, it must sometimes be bombarded with the mundane so when the "Goodness" reappears it will always remain as "Goodness". Therefore, even the mundane has it's purpose of maintaining the "Goodness" for your eyes only.
This too works in the opposing directly as well.
So, let's repose the entire statement containing it's opposition:
It has to do with perception. If you are continually exposed with "Malevolence" eventually your perception of "Malevolence" is decreased due to exposure and eventually becomes mundane but is perceived as "Acceptable" and continues to retain it's "Acceptable" nature. However, if "Acceptable" is to retain it's "Malevolence" in your perception, it must sometimes be bombarded with the mundane so when the "Malevolence" reappears it will always remain as "Malevolence". Therefore, even the mundane has it's purpose of maintaining the "Malevolence" for your eyes only. Be afraaaaaaiiiiiidd!

That's why: "Whatever so exists within the clear and present observation shall hence forth reafirm any faith to which thou dost believe"

Even if it's the faith of "Losing faith".

That's why: "Faith being as potential energy therefore has potential of energy and exists as such. Therefore, faith cannot be destroyed, only changes into another form."

Some people would say I'm being too advantageous with my faith. I would reply humbly with, "Exactly".

And with that, therefore, the potential to turn faith into advantageous so to exists the potential for faith to be turned into disadvantageous, and thus RedCream's Faith is that other people's faith is disadvantageous to him, therefore it needs to perish or change just as his has. Only for him, he is a true believer hence his continual bombardment of his segregative statements.

What takes greater amount of courage and strength?
Believing in what you see?
Seeing everything you believe?

So, for RedCream, his faith of Beliving in what he sees is continually reinforced, even as I type this message.

*patiently awaiting RedCream's potential reply*

>>55,
^See what happens when you click on the above link. epic lulz.

...:O...:)

>>62
Is that a riddle or somehting

The funny thing about life is often that we are blind to what is right in front of us even though we have the potential to see everything.

>>66, perhaps a riddle. But which is easier and which is harder? For me, it is already easy to believe in what I see as it is perceivable by my senses. But to see what I believe takes a greater skill, courage, strength, and resolve to overcome it's disbelief in others. So too does the creator of this anime:
Kara no Kyoukai - The Garden of Sinners 01
While by appearances you might think of what the title infers. But what is missed is the context of the event. Once the event is viewed, then what is remembered is infered, and so too the context is missed. What is it that's missed? What is it that you are looking for even though you are here? For me, what I am here to do is so great and terrifying to most that they would rather not look at it. What is it that people aren't choosing to look at out of the imagined fear of self-preservation? My answer for myself is me. But for you, what is it for you? What aren't you looking at?

So true is the shock, the fear, the shame, and the denial that arises when what one person chooses not to see that I myself become the object of their attention rather than the context of what I'm saying is attempting to make them aware of themselves. By that very action of assisting in another person's self-awareness so too I shall become the object of worship and scapegoating, as it has been so for years long since past so too shall it be in the future for many years until the day of revelation (the day that a person reveals the uknown about themselves to be perceived by themselves of themselves). The day that the true dragon is revealed for its tyranny by its tyranny(the ego is the single greatest source of evil and also the second greatest source of true greatness). But perhaps, even I am only inferring what I am saying to be true, therein lies the search for being less-wrong, and the revelation of what is already around us and inside us as truth. Perhaps if I refrain from technical vernacularisms and retain poetic riddles the message will remain a mystery only to those who choose not to go down the rabbit hole and instead follow what is already known. Who am I to know such things but a fallible, vulnerable, temptable human being.

And thank you >>66, I now know how to write my book. I will use axioms and riddles to pursuade the ignorant masses to follow what is right for them by them, something that they already know they should be doing, but have chosen not to.

"So, go forth once more into the darkness of night and forge forth from the pit of despair victorious wielding such courage that even the haughtiest of belivers will be blinded in their greatest hours. Make great the weapon of war by the dragon's fury for it too shall it be as your sword and shield. Let it's bright light pierce the veil of complacent ignorance tempting with its silly hat and bells and whistles. What glory shall come in the name of thee who standith alone with the glory of thine heart and faith amongst all those who are true to themselves? We stand as one not by the ignorant voice of one, but by the defined differences and united understandings of all. So standith us all as one."

^^^btw, I just got 69...:P ^^^

So, for RedCream...
He is a non-believing believer consistently expelling and regurgitating his own tamp-axiom thereby retaining his own level of intelligence. Way to go, RedCream! You have proven your loyalty to ignorance! You WIN!

Something that RedCream fails at everytime is his lack of common sense, namely using his senses appropriately. If we can ignore something that is right in front of us than we can be aware of something that Might be right in front of us. This is the use of speculation. Something RedCream uses only when it suits his disadvantageous point of view. RedCream still lives in the Good vs Evil realm (God vs Devil). It's funny because he even claims that religion is fraud, so he's actually denying his own actions after the fact of evidential review. *props to 4chan.org forum, btw* All you have to do is use your senses to see, then use your memory, then combine both to form choice. I do this to find out what I don't know by choosing to do something I believe (know) to be wrong. Like arbitrarily kissing a girl on the cheek to see if it's appropriate or not. But, that's why RedCream lives in his mom's basement crying about stinky bums when he in fact is one of the same. Basically, everything RedCream hates about everyone else is actually what he hates in himself. Jeez, RedCream...your paranoia and delusions have sunk you deep into the well of despair, but you keep digging thinking you'll find something for sure...meanwhile, us aware folk up top look down and say, "Thank god he's doing all that work, I'd hate to be that far down...what would happen if...*pushes dirt on top of RedCream's head*...ooops..Tee-hee. :P

So, Nanami, if you are still reading all this nonsense, that's good, learn what other people believe in and believe that we believe what we are saying. This is placing your sense of perception within ours and by this you will be able to better perceive your own actions. Perception is the answer, just as religion is the answer, Science is the question, just as doing the wrong thing just to see what's wrong about it is also the question. To take something you know (believe) to find out what you don't know (hidden). When this is completed every moment you are alive, you will consistently find the miraculous in the mundane, but only if you believe. It seems that you are already questioning so props to you as well. Perhaps I'm already preaching to the choir? If so, this then reinforces the axiom of belief, or you may have yet another means to use it to your advantage. No matter what, take everything you find and use it to your advantage. This is known as being human. <this is for those that think we are something else seperate from everything else. What rubbish. Our differences define us, our similarities unite us. There profits and gains all the way.

Yes, I understand completely.
Guess there's other ways of seeing things.

So, now "Guess there's other ways of seeing things." has the potential to become your next axiom, if you're interested. What other perceptions have I overlooked? What mysteries lay in wait for me in the near future?
So, as a sign of good faith I bestow to you a great and mystical gift that if observed by others will be the marking of your own destruction by them, simply state that you turn answers into questions and their intelligent haughtiness will overwhelm them into inactive blissful submission as is what they desire so too shall you reward their deeds.

I bestow upon you the ability to question answers.
-you have already expressed your need for this gift within this thread as well as the ability.
-Another perception of this method is also explained below:
>use what you know to find out what you don't know
>persue ignorance if you are intelligent and intelligence if you are ignorant, either way you will find wisdom.
>what DO you know or believe as fact and fiction, pursue these till an altered state of perception is attained, therein lies the truth.

And why is it that everyone elses hatred grows with your self-awareness growth? For every action there is an equal reaction AND an opposing reaction. What is apparent at first is the opposition or resistence. What pervails through persistence is equal to the initial action. Meaning what you see is what you get from your actions. Mark well your actions, look to them for guidance, be true to yourself. Mark this well, and choices can only grow for you, with you, by you. The best wishes to you and your endeavours, Nanami!

Examples of the aforementioned axiom as questions:

"What are other ways of seeing things?"
"How may I perceive other ways of seeing things?"
"Where may I perceive other ways of seeing things?"
"When do I perceive other ways of seeing things?"
"Why do I perceive other ways of seeing things?"

These are mere examples, but what you have the potential to do with them is entirely up to you. I have already explored them myself, but to me they are experience, to you they may still yet reside as imagination. So, from your perspective, what is imagination and what is experience? What defines them? What common factors can unite them? <this one's pretty easy, both reside in the brain for one. XD
And most importantly, don't forget humour as it is a powerful asset beyond all measure.

The Three Life Rules: Change, Humour, and Paradox
Socrates: Paradox...
Dan Millman: Life is a mystery. Don't waste time trying to figure it out.
Socrates: Humour...
Dan Millman: Keep a sense of humour, especially about yourself. It is a strength beyond all measure.
Socrates: Change...
Dan Millman: Know that nothing stays the same.
Dan Millman: I took for granted what I could do. I was sloppy with my life; I'm scared but I feel like I got rid of all the old stuff and it was the right thing to do.
Socrates: Death isn't sad. The sad thing is most people don't live at all.

lol wut at this thread

Oh, FTW, I just turned my 23 year liability of inactivity into my 23 year asset of experience towards my research, whoops, guess it's time to begin the book now that the research is already done. How well this should serve me in my persuits. I guess I wasn't as aware as others said I am. Now that I can see, I see them as the truly intelligent ones and yes, I am ignorant and so too shall I be in order to pursue awareness by seeking other ignorance within myself and beyond.

Darkness = Unknown, Ignorance, Imagination
Light is the cause of Darkness
Light    = Choice, Awareness, Experience
Pursue darkness and light will follow your footsteps.
Pursue light and darkness will envelope your footsteps.

So, basically:
What happens when you look at the sun? Blindness.
What happens when you use the sun to see darkness? Awareness.
RedCream is a Sun whoreshipper. XD
RedCream is so fat no one's found Hoffa yet.
RedCream is so ignorant, his movements appear that of a snail
RedCream is so infantile, even Michael Jackson has his eyes on him. "Ooh, may I touch that" *hand stretches to touch ass cheek, SLAP*
RedCream Fails so hard, that even when he's being taken to the hospital for loosing his dick, he blames the poker players instead.
RedCream is RedCream, because that's all RedCream can be, just red...cream....yesh, that's all...bloody...fucking...cumcicle. RedCream so full of bullshit, his expressions tell of his next eruption. (>.<);

(post truncated, cont)
RedCream is so infantile, even Michael Jackson has his eyes on him. "Ooh, may I touch that" *hand stretches to touch ass cheek, SLAP*
RedCream Fails so hard, that even when he's being taken to the hospital for loosing his dick, he blames the poker players instead.
RedCream is RedCream, because that's all RedCream can be, just red...cream....yesh, that's all...bloody...fucking...cumcicle. RedCream so full of bullshit, his expressions tell of his next eruption. (>.<);

().()<butt cheeks
(>.<)<RedCream's face

What's the similarities?
Both have cheecks.
Both have spincters.
Both expell shit out their orifices.
Both stink like shit.
Both can offend the general public.
Both should be hidden from the public eye.

What are the differences?
RedCream's ass has hair around its mouth..wait, there's hair around RedCream's mouth on his face too...Ok.
RedCream's face has more orifices than his ass...wait, does that mean the greater potential for shit?..ok.
RedCream's ass has a lot of double-layers to it...wait, so does his neck, as a triple-chin. Christ...Anyone? Can anyone tell the difference between RedCream's face and an ass? All I can see is similarities, fuck this is really hard *slaps RedCream's cock out of face*, you cow-towed queer-eye. Return from whence thou hath cum, Demon RedCream. *RedCream slams semi-hard-dick into his mom's ass* "You missed, asshole! BTW, FTW, you fuck like you type, all over the fucking place without any fucking gain. Shit, is it already tomorrow?"-RedCream's Mom; the next day