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HARD DRIVES

Name: Anonymous 2007-06-10 15:02 ID:icqaWoiP

So I'm getting a third hard drive, and was wondering whether there is a big reason to get internal over external.
I want to use it to store shit that I'll be using often, not as just backup.

Name: Anonymous 2007-06-10 15:40 ID:Heaven

External drives suck, that's why.

Also, go 2.5" or smaller, there's no reason to buy a noisy 3.5" crap drive.

Name: Anonymous 2007-06-10 16:47 ID:rxyYmblt

>>1
Internal drives -> DMA -> really fast (up to ~130 MB/s)
External drives -> USB -> rather slow (up to ~ 40 MB/s)
That said I don't recognize a difference as far as games on external drives are concerned and watching anime isn't a problem as well. So, go the cheaper way?

Name: Anonymous 2007-06-11 3:59 ID:TOm57WfN

Internal advantages:
- Speed (only really matters if you are editing video or using it as intermediate storage)
- Can boot windows
- Can't be stolen unless entire computer is stolen or chassis is breached
- Internal drive cannot suffer impact damage from tripping over usb cord or being stepped on

External advantages:
- Portability
- External power can act as security if you suspect external parties via servers are misusing your data
- Don't have to open computer to install
- Can have up to 127 of them if you use USB and have your own power plant
- Disposability if you get v&

Name: 2007-06-11 5:36 ID:Gh5CxrOp

Externals are much worse for games that frequently access the hard drive or must load large files from the hard drive. If your internal hard drives are of acceptable size, I would suggest getting a large external drive and moving anime/movie files over to it and just use the internals for heavy-hitting games.

The biggest factor for me is cost. There are special cases you can buy that will basically turn any internal hard drive into an external USB drive, so if you can find a cheap 500GB drive, external or internal, you can use either externally. The drive bays that do this weren't very expensive last time I checked (less than $40?), though I can't vouch for their quality.

Name: Anonymous 2007-06-11 8:30 ID:QHueHoDo

>>5
I've seen 500GB external drives for about €100, putting down $40 for a case seems a bit "doing it myself even though I get it cheaper in stores for the heck of it".

Name: Anonymous 2007-06-11 12:09 ID:3ws5wazZ

OP here, I started with a 120GB that has the OS and programs etc etc, then got a 300GB which I use to store stuff like images and videos. The new one I want is 500GB, and will be used exactly the same as the second one.
Also, I only have one computer so portability wouldn't be of any use. An external would just be permanently plugged in...

The main reason I'm asking is that I'd rather buy it from a store than the Internet- and the store nearby has internal and external that are the same price; the internal is a brand I've never heard of and the external is Maxtor- the same as my current two that I've had for years with no problem.

Name: Anonymous 2007-06-11 16:59 ID:SxetZCMZ

>>6
Maxtors (Seagate DiamondMax)? No thanks.

Name: Anonymous 2007-06-12 5:01 ID:74oXZ/7l

>>2
Yes, 2.5" drives are quiet.  But they are also low capacity, expensive, and SLOW as fuck.  Disk I/O is the worst bottleneck in any system.  Improved bandwidth is the same reason to go for an internal drive instead of an external.

>>1
500 GB Samsung SpinPoint T.  SATA-300, 16 MB cache, as fast as WD's 10,000 RPM Raptors at 7200 RPM temps, quieter than any Seagate, relatively inexpensive, low power consumption.  Nobody should be buying any other SATA drive right now, unless they need Seagate's 5 year warranty or want to go perpendicular or 10K RPM (or U320).

Name: Anonymous 2007-06-12 5:35 ID:wWvjNuzg

>>9
Disk I/O is the worst bottleneck in any system.
But only when it's a bottleneck.

Name: Anonymous 2007-06-12 7:26 ID:CmoIkyAG

It's never lupus

Name: Anonymous 2007-06-12 13:32 ID:74oXZ/7l

>>10
Even when it isn't a significant bottleneck, the hard disk is one of the cheapest things you can upgrade that directly affects performance on so many levels:  booting, compiling/installing/running programs, finding/opening/saving documents, running virtual memory, etc.  The higher capacity and lower cost of 3.5" drives only improves their value proposition against quieter 2.5" drives, especially when you consider that a quiet 3.5" drive will barely be audible over the noise a typical 80 mm CPU heatsink fan makes.  If you're trying to be quieter than a low-RPM 120 mm fan, sure, maybe 2.5" hard drives make more sense.

Name: Anonymous 2007-06-12 20:32 ID:giIlbz+i

ONLY BUY SEAGATE OR WESTERN DIGITAL!

You'd be a fucking idiot to get anything else.

Internal HDD FTW.

Name: Anonymous 2007-06-13 6:26 ID:6tv5FvGD

>>13
Fail.

Of course Seagate is normally the safe choice, UNLESS you find yourself looking at a former Maxtor model.

WD reliability is much worse, but at least their best drives are fast and silent.

Ignoring the Samsung SpinPoints is one of the stupidest things a PC builder can do these days.

Name: Anonymous 2007-06-13 6:30 ID:kWw5Y1Z5

>>14
I've been using HDDs for over 20 yrs. Seagate and WD.

Seagate hard to kill. Only ever had 1 die.
WD WILL die within 8-10yrs
Maxtor WILL die within 4-5yrs
Samsung WILL die within 2-3yrs
Fujitsu MAY not even live long enough for the install...

So no >>14 you fail as all you did was enforce what >>13 already said as you suggested fuck-all-else.

Name: Anonymous 2007-06-13 7:42 ID:VtrPVBZG

WHAT ABOUT IBM HARDDRIVES???

Name: Anonymous 2007-06-13 9:11 ID:6tv5FvGD

>>15
Swallow a cock and twirl in place.  20 years - ha, yeah, I had a PC when I was 10 too, old man.  You've impressed only yourself with that one.  Today's Samsung is not the Samsung of five years ago, no less 10 or 15 years ago, in ANY of their product lines.  I say this both as someone with two SpinPoint Ts at home and also as someone with a fucking c.1999 4.3 GB Samsung which, while slow as shit, is still spinning fine in a build only recently pulled out of service.  Whereas Samsung used to be a joke, SpinPoint T is the whole damn show now.

Anyway, since isolated anecdotes are useless, here are mine to go with yours:

From what I can remember of the past 9 years of workstation builds and repairs for 200-300 heads, we have had at least about 5 (mostly old) Seagates, 15 WDs (including 3 Raptors we bought for ourselves in IS), 10 Maxtors, 5 old Samsungs, 2 old Fujitsus, 5 IBMs (all from the Poland factory I believe), and 0 Hitachis (we never purchased any) die on us, along with many old no-names that shipped along with OEM PCs.  All new builds since FY07 started have been either Barracudas for ATA-100 or SpinPoint Ts for SATA.  No RMAs yet, and no calls yet have been attributable to disk failure.  And guess what - the Spinpoints really are quieter.

As for your guaranteed caps on lifespan, I have drives that are swapped in and out every few months from all of the above manufacturers (plus a handful of Conners and Quantums from before my time here) that still work.  Our oldest Conner is from 1991 and still has a functional Netware install on it.

>>16
Hitachi, now.  Supposedly they still run hot like IBMs always did.  As bad or worse than Maxtor - they always developed clicking heads faster than anyone else.

Name: Anonymous 2007-06-13 9:38 ID:U7BHmW7b

>>15
Thanks for sharing your insight. My experience with hard disks is:

Seagate Barracuda: Never had one die, though I'm not 100% happy with my second latest one (160 business gigabytes, 7200.9 Barracuda SATA), gets hot and read errors go high under heavy activity (defragmenting) for an hour.

Western Digital: I didn't own enough units to say, but I have a very good image of it.

Hitachi DeskStar: Never tried any, but I have a good image of it. Though it's expensive.

Samsung: Dies in about 5 years, though I'm still using two Samsungs which are both 10 years old. There was a third one (same model) who died just a few months ago. I'm overall happy with the ones I got, but it was 8-12 years ago, I don't know about the new ones.

Maxtor/Seagate DiamondMax: Dies like Aeris, and it takes 2-5 years to die. Every Maxtor I had died while it was still in use. I have a collection of dead Maxtors decorating my room.

Fujitsu: FUCKING PIECES OF SHIT, FAIL ENSURED WITHIN A YEAR. I saw like 5 of them. 4 died within a year, 1 lasted like 4. Terrible, I never saw hardware this bad. And I could tell you about big ass makers of big ass blade servers with big ass prices who use these pieces of shit. They fail all the time, the fuckers. They usually last 2-3 months.


>>17
old Fujitsus
Old? In MY Fujitsu? Wait, you mean 6 months. That's old for Fujitsu.

Also, please talk about ratios; you said 15 WDs dies vs. 10 Maxtors, but how many of each did you have in the first place?

Name: Anonymous 2007-06-13 12:55 ID:6tv5FvGD

>>18
Going on memory, maybe 100 each of WD and Seagate (including many old, small drives, 1 RMA on a U160 Cheetah, and RMAs on 3 Raptors).  About 60-70 Maxtors we bought at retail for projects over the years.  Around 50 IBMs, and less than

Name: Anonymous 2007-06-13 12:56 ID:6tv5FvGD

Shit, sorry.

>>18
Going on memory:

We were using Seagate U160 Cheetahs for servers and WD for all WS builds for several years when a local sourcer was giving us good volume deals on both.  Those 15 WDs included 2 DOA drives (Raptors) and 2 short-term failures (Raptor #3 and something from a few years ago), plus a lot of old ones in the 2-10 GB range from ancient builds.  Total of no less than 100.  The rest still work, but most have been retired due to age.  This only means that old WDs don't hold up, but still, much worse than our track record with Seagate.

The ~10 Maxtors were out of around 60 or 70 drives, from a combination of white-boxes/pre-builts and a handful of drives we bought cheap at retail (rebates) for pinch projects.  Of course that practice stopped real fast.  Some of the rest are still in service, including a few 30-60 GB drives we bought in 2001, but they are replaced once bearing noise starts kicking in.

The Seagate deaths were all very old ATA drives and 1 RMA on a 18 GB Cheetah.  Every other Seagate that is no longer in service was retired for age (at the time, outgrowing our expensive U160 arrays in favor of larger SATA-150 drives), not because of wear and tear.  This is out of about 100 drives (not including the Barracudas we have deployed currently), many of which were admittedly SCSI drives that were never going to fail.

I'd say less than 50 DeathStars (all IBM, Poland) and less than 10-20 units each of any other manufacturer.  We never actively bought these other brands; they would usually come with the pre-builts we ordered or received as donations.  A note about the IBMs we had:  they ran hotter than any other drive at the same speed, and they were noisy as hell, if not due to head failure, then due to the loudest fucking bearing noise that seemingly got worse on a monthly basis.  About three years ago we replaced and wiped every single IBM drive regardless of current age / noise level.  I should take them home and give them to people I hate.

The Fujitsu failures are 2.5 GB and 3.2 GB drives that I don't know the story about but are just in an old dead drive pyramid one of our guys keeps.  The other 10 or so ran fine until we pulled them a long time ago (former W98 installs that were upgraded W95 installs).  I didn't install them, and I didn't care about their reputation, but I remember the surviving ones didn't seem to have any problems.

Spinpoint Ts we started using frankly because I and a few of the other IS guys had started buying Samsungs for our home machines, and we ended up loving them for the speed, low temps, low noise, and low price.  Director said cool, did his own research, and now they are the only SATA drives we use on new workstations.  I guess I shouldn't really care if people don't use them, but I'll use them for as long as they work this well, especially at the price.  Then again, we've never encountered a bad one yet out of maybe 30 builds so far, so I can't tell you how bad a bad Spinpoint can be.  Quality control seems a lot better than on our old Samsungs.  And it's not that Seagates are BAD in comparison, I like them, but these drives continue to keep us happy and we still consider them the new hotness around here.

Name: Anonymous 2007-06-13 15:19 ID:afooUGFw

Thanks for your insight

Name: Anonymous 2007-06-14 2:37 ID:vq0470Zo

>>17
>>18
>>20
tl;dr - Just get to the fucking point already!

At least >>15 was short and sweet. Proving once again that no matter how much crap you spout you can still be completely fucking wrong eh >>17, >>18 and >>20

Only way you fuckers got any qualifications was sucking teachers dick and just agreeing to everything they said eh...

Name: Anonymous 2007-06-14 3:52 ID:C9Xa/Dvv

I have an old Conner Peripherals 1GB drive, manufactured in 1994, that still works.  Has 63 remapped sectors.

I have an even older Control Data Corporation Type 39 RLL drive, probably manufactured in 86 or 87, that still works to this day.  Capacity is like 74MB.  Has one bad sector though.

Name: Anonymous 2007-06-14 4:20 ID:L4jPKFVd

>>22
tl;dr version:

Seagate: BUY THIS HARD DISK
WD: Buy
Hitachi: Avoid
Maxtor: Crap
Fujitsu: Kill with fire

Name: Anonymous 2007-06-14 4:20 ID:L4jPKFVd

>>24
Ah, and I forgot:

Samsung: BUY

Name: Anonymous 2007-06-14 15:43 ID:X0G/wOtx

Man, are you guys cereal? Should I be concerned about my 4 year old Maxtor? ):

Name: Anonymous 2007-06-17 14:13 ID:gvnFh9hr

>>26

Yes.

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