64-bit leap?

Welp.. Got a new 6800 Ultra in the system. Beautiful card, runs faster, but I'm damn sure I got a pretty bad bottleneck with my 3200+. Why? Because although 90% of the time it's 2x faster than my old 5900 Ultra, there are still places in games (Doom3 and Half-Life2) that run at 30fps. Technically, that's not all that bad, but what bugs me is it runs at 30fps REGARDLESS of the quality settings. I don't have vsync on. It runs the same speed at 640x480 lowest settings in Doom 3 in a certain area as it does at 1024x768 4xAA 8xAF, which tells me my system is choking. The question is: would I see much of an improvement if I upgraded to a 64-bit 3200+ on a dual channel motherboard (I have 2x512 sticks)? I know the processor is no different in raw megahertz, but with a dual channel setup and and direct path to the processor instead of an FSB could I expect much improvement? I'm kinda hesitant to shell out $300+ if it's not going to make a difference. Opinions?

2get!!

Most programs out now are not optimised for 64bit cpu's You won't notice any difference.
The cpu will be flaunting it's reverse compatibility feature most of the time. (Which will be as fast as the 32bit program will allow)
Windows longhorn is the 64bit future for microshit operating systems (and it looks awful)
There are a few linux distro's which are 64 bit compatible. That's about it though.

>>3
http://www.freebsd.org/platforms/amd64.html
http://www.freebsd.org/platforms/ia64/index.html
http://www.freebsd.org/platforms/sparc.html
http://www.freebsd.org/platforms/alpha.html

64-bit isn't "faster" than 32-bit. Speed increases are because the rest of the processor is faster. If anything, 64-bit is usually slower since your memory structures are suddenly larger and take up more system bandwidth.

>>5
64-bit is "faster" for two reasons. And this assumes two things: (1) We're comparing x86 to x86-64.
(2) We're in native mode for each. IE we're comparing identical programs that are compiled and optimized for each processor.
 - You only need one 64-bit register to hold a IEEE double -- that alone will make anything using doubles much faster.  There will also be no reason not to use 64-bit words, so trivial changes could give huge speedups to algorithms that were originally designed for 32-bit processors.
 - Eight general purpose registers were added. This turns the x86 from a stack machine to something that can utilize its cycles much more efficiently.  I suppose they could hardwire the reverse compatibility mode to have the first 48 bytes (or whatever) of the cache be stored in the unused registers, but I'm guessing that would be a little too complicated.
 - "64-bit is usually slower since your memory structures are suddenly larger and take up more system bandwidth" is just ignorance. If there are 64 data lines and 6 address lines, the "bandwidth" is negotiated in 64-bit blocks anyway, which makes it just as fast as though it were 32 bits. They're still working at the same clock speeds. That's like arguing that 8-bit is faster than 32-bit for the same reason. Wow, if it's 8-bit, the "memory structures" (people who aren't idiots call it "alignment") are only one byte!

So, to answer the original question, it's not quite worth $300, but it would be faster if it were compiled specifically for x86-64. AMD says that there would be an immediate 25% performance gain thanks to the integrated memory controller, but I'd put more trust in actual benchmarks.

In most applications, where AMD64-native code scores a win over 32-bit x86 code is /not/ in being 64-bit, but rather in having twice as many general-purpose registers--16 rather than 8.  More registers means fewer instructions and, more importantly, fewer memory accesses being needed to do the same work.

As far as I know, there's no way to run 64-bit applications under an existing 32-bit operating system like Windows XP (though you /can/ run 32-bit applications under a 64-bit OS if the OS is designed to allow such).  The CPU needs to be put into "long mode" to unlock the wider registers and the eight new registers, and the mode-changing instruction is privileged.

>>6
Modern x86 CPUs (I think as far back as the PII or PIII, maybe even further) already contain more registers internally than are exposed via the instruction set.  Look up "register renaming".  As far as I know, putting the AMD64 into long mode just exposes some of the registers that in 32-bit mode are used for renaming.

To the original poster:  Even in 32-bit mode, the Athlon64 is a generation ahead of the AthlonXP in capabilities.  Think of the Athlon64 vs. the AthlonXP as being like the (32-bit) 80386 compared to the (16-bit) 80286.  Assuming you're old enough to know what those are :)  Even running pure 16-bit code, the 386 was a shitload faster than the 286.

>>8
Interesting. Well, in any case, compilers are given extra power to dictate how the registers are used, and that, at least intuitively, seems like a Good Thing.

>>10
Yes, it's definitely a Good Thing to have twice as many "visible" registers, for the reasons described already.  I only intended to correct the misconception that there are a bunch of physical registers on an AMD64 CPU that just sit completely idle until the CPU is put into long mode.

If you have the money. More power to you.
But if you already have the best of the last gen amd. You might as well hold off till you find something comfortable that is compatible with the cpu.

　　        ∧＿∧
　　　／（´Д｀　）ヽ
　　ｍn´（＿（＿nｍ

>>6
I was comparing PPC-32 (which doesn't suck and already has 64-bit-wide floating registers) to PPC-64. I believe the system busses in ppc32 systems are already 64 bits wide.

>>3

Very true.  Most OSX apps are still 32bit.  Hell most don't even utlize the dual procs.  This will change.

>>15
Anything that uses CoreAudio or QuickTime is instantly threaded. Also, every app uses 32-bit pointers at the moment, and Tiger won't affect the situation since 64-bit tools in Tiger can't use any of the GUI or fancier system libraries. A very small amount may use 64-bit integer math already, but most couldn't do anything useful with it. AltiVec is a much better alternative for many things.

TRUTH: The only use any of you have for 64-bit processing is to play more complex Videogames.

I thought it was for more realistic skintones.

Video games are all floating-point.

you can have several virtual server on one machine.
That is very useful for down sizeing server space.

http://www.sonicstate.com/news/shownews.cfm?newsid=1188
compaile all the server software and, optimize those sorce code with 64bit native compailer

I think its the ram thats the problem with the currents Boards that support 64bit if you intend on getting a new system w/ 64bit and want superwow mega ram (2GIG) hold of till june

You guys seem to have the question all wrong. He is asking if an upgrade to an athlon 64 3200+ will out perform his current XP 3200+. The answer is yes, the processors archetecture is better than the xp line.  The major improvent is the on die memory controller. I typically get under 59 ns latencies, while the xp will get over 100 ns. the P4 has trouble getting under 80 ns.  It would be worth the upgrade, just check for the socket type.  The dual channel verson of that chip is socket 939.  Just make sure that the chip is also that, because there is also a socket 754 version of it.

re654635ttrt

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