I know it has good points as well but thats not for this thread. thanks.
Name:
Anonymous2007-02-06 13:48
>>39
programming languages aren't natural by definition, numbnuts. and in natural languages you still have formal rules to make written text unambiguous, but a fucking peon like you probably couldn't even think that far, you just go about yapping your nonsense with line breaks like you thought it was a haiku
>>40
so the difference between forced indentation and forced statement separators (semicolons) is what, exactly? are you idiots maybe upset because you suddenly can't use your own obnoxious indentation "style"?
Name:
Anonymous2007-02-06 13:56
I have over 65,535 years programming experience writing XBOX-SIZED programs that you couldn't even begin to comprehend with 100% of your brains. I wrote the first ANSI C compiler when I was -12 years old, using ANSI C.
You should just accept everything I say, I don't HAVE to give any reasons for my arguments because I am GUIDO ROSS.
Name:
Anonymous2007-02-06 13:56
so the difference between forced indentation and forced statement separators (semicolons) is what, exactly?
No do/while loops and a hamstrung lambda.
I rarely use lambda, but I miss do/while...
Name:
Anonymous2007-02-06 14:07
>>40
You seem to like C, but I can't help but notice that you did not declare the value of FALSE. That would result in some pretty bad errors...
tl;dr version: #define FALSE 0
Name:
Anonymous2007-02-06 14:12
>>43
who cares for multiline lambdas if you can just use def, and are you sure the lack of do while is because of the off-side rule?
Name:
Anonymous2007-02-06 14:20
<code>
for (AppleJuice juice : aj) {
Person moot = new Person();
while (juice.content != 0) {
moot.drink(new Glass(juice.getJuice(
(new MesureMent(15)).setMesure("cl"))));
}
}
</code>
>>48
one word: trying-to-be-clever-but-failing-miserably
Name:
Anonymous2007-02-06 17:11
>>49
forced-indenting is not clever either, it fails, enjoy your:
if ...:
if ...:
if ...: # fucked up indentation, welcome to Hell.
Name:
Anonymous2007-02-06 17:50
>>50
how about you shut your fucking yap hole before I stab you in the eye. here's a clue: YOUR LITTLE BONEHEADED EXCUSE FOR A POST MAKES NO SENSE
Name:
Anonymous2007-02-06 17:53
who cares for multiline lambdas if you can just use def
I like pointless functions about as much as I like pointless classes. Leave boilerplate to C++, kthx.
and are you sure the lack of do while is because of the off-side rule?
How would you implement do/while in python?
Of course, to be fair, do/while is a bit of a hack in braced languages as well.
Name:
Anonymous2007-02-06 18:03
>>43
Forced indentation did not prevent making do..while or repeat..until loops. It's just that Guido thought it unnecessary, or rather, he was being a dick so he challenged people to enumerate places where it'd be clearly better than while in the standard library, then he'd add it.
As for lambda, you can have multiline lambdas BTW:
l = (lambda x, y:
x + y) #Multiline lambda
The real problem is multi-statement lambdas, which you don't have. The best you can do is implement something like C's comma operator, e.g.
def last(*p):
return p[-1]
>>45
Tru.dat, the only problem with def is it's not an expression like JavaScript's function; you have to forcefully name it into a temporary variable (which you may reuse). For that purpose, I use underscore:
>>50
No, you're the fail, and your post did not make sense. Forced indentation is harder to fail than braces, unless you are not used to indenting your code, in which case you suck.
Name:
Anonymous2007-02-06 18:40
he was being a dick so he challenged people to enumerate places where it'd be clearly better than while in the standard library
thing is, you can do the same with a regular loop, adding a conditional break at the end; it just looks less pretty
As for lambda, you can have multiline lambdas BTW
I think what was meant was more complex statements inside a lambda, but, in that case, you should use a nested function, and lambdas are just syntactic sugar anyway
I like pointless functions about as much as I like pointless classes.
I'm sensing you're someone who has no clue
all in all, the best tards like >>50 can come up with is minor quibbling about the syntax, because it requires no brainwork
Name:
Anonymous2007-02-06 18:42
I think what was meant was more complex statements inside a lambda, but, in that case, you should use a nested function, and lambdas are just syntactic sugar anyway
oops, didn't read the rest of >>53 before replying
Name:
Anonymous2007-02-06 20:04
I'm sensing you're someone who has no clue
I like to think I do, but I'm always happy to learn something different. So, tell me how I'm wrong, chum.
see here
Thanks for the link. However, unless I've missed something (I must have):
do:
<setup code>
while <condition>:
<loop body>
Is little different from:
<setup code>
while <condition>:
<loop body>
So, that's just increasing the code, not the reverse. It doesn't solve the problem. Perhaps if you could demonstrate how it'll help with something like:
do {
print(x);
print(x%1);
print(x%2);
x++;
} while(x >= 5);
Since do/while loops always execute at least once, with python you'd currently get:
print(x)
print(x%1)
print(x%2)
x += x
while x >= 5:
print(x)
print(x%1)
print(x%2)
x += x
How would the proposed addition help? I'd be much obliged.
do:
print(x)
print(x%1)
print(x%2)
x += x
while x >= 5:
pass
oh, gee, would you look at this
I like to think I do, but I'm always happy to learn something different. So, tell me how I'm wrong, chum.
no, I think sucking cocks is alright for you after all
Name:
Anonymous2007-02-07 3:33
or:
while True:
print(x)
print(x%1)
print(x%2)
x += x
if x >= 5: break
Name:
Anonymous2007-02-07 3:39
>>60
That is... ugly. I'm glad to see people are thinking twice on the mailing lists.
no, I think, etc
No explanation? Just an insult? Grow up.
>>54 thing is, you can do the same with a regular loop, adding a conditional break at the end; it just looks less pretty
Sure, Guido challenged people to find enough places where do..while would make things look better.
While I think Python has a very elegant design that successfully straddles the fine line between the minimalism of Lisp and the rococo complexities of Perl, it's certainly not perfect. There are various design features that I consider ugly, or at least suboptimal in some way. This essay will examine the most significant problems in Python as I perceive them, assisted by suggestions from the comp.lang.python crowd.
The purpose of this discussion isn't to bash Python, or to second-guess GvR; most of these problems are rather difficult to solve and don't have any obviously correct solution, even if one disregarded backward compatibility. Instead, the goal is simply to demonstrate awareness of Python's flaws, and to ask if they're fixable. One test of whether someone is a good programmer is to ask them to assess the tools they use -- languages, libraries, and operating systems. Someone who cannot perceive flaws or express an opinion about the low and high points of a design is either not accustomed to thinking analytically about the systems they encounter or is blindly partisan in the service of their chosen favorites. Computing, at least in the exploratory fields where I hang out, is more of an art than a science, and inability to critique a design is a serious liability.
Name:
Anonymous2007-02-07 8:13
>>69
Truth. That's why I, despite being the biggest Python fag fanboy, was quick to take this thread seriously in >>5. I want this fixed just exactly because I like Python so much.
Also, 70GET
Name:
Anonymous2007-02-07 10:24
oh yeah, I almost forgot, there is a hidden feature that you can use curly braces as block delimiters in python too! you do it like this:
def fun(): #{
print 'Hello World'
...
#}
>>75
If that's all that's bad about Python, Python is a great language.
Name:
Anonymous2007-02-07 15:28
>>76
That's more than anything for me to dump this piece of a crappy language. I want to be in control, you aren't by writing in Python, you'll suffer from it and enjoy your IDE modifying your algorithm because it used tabs by mistake instead of spaces.
>>> from __future__ import braces
File "<stdin>", line 1
SyntaxError: not a chance
ROFLMAO
Name:
Anonymous2007-02-07 15:30
>>77
that's total bullshit and you know it. if you're not using proper identing in any other language, you suck MAJOR cock anyways
wait, no, judging how much braindead code is out there, it's actually very likely that you're an incompetent fucktard
Name:
Anonymous2007-02-07 15:33
>>79
you haven't read my code, I only give the legal rights to the company I work for, that's what the law allows me to do. And I can bend rules whenever I want, if I need to indent differently to be able to format something better, I can do it while you can't, duckfart.