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C/C++

Name: Galilee 2006-08-16 18:26

So my question is simple ; of the two which would be advisable to learn first.

All the C++ books tell me to learn C++ over C ,but on the internet im told that learning C gives better grasps of concepts.

Which should i learn first and why?

Name: Anonymous 2006-08-16 18:40

Learn C first.

Then learn ObjC or D.

Only learn C++ if you're a masochist in need of a job. It's not as bad as Java, but it comes close.

Name: Anonymous 2006-08-16 18:45

>>2

Name: Anonymous 2006-08-16 19:14

>>2

Name: Anonymous 2006-08-17 0:27

i prefer c++ over c just because it has references and the struct initializing thing. that is all.

Name: Anonymous 2006-08-17 1:00

>>2
That pretty much sums it up.

Name: Anonymous 2006-08-17 1:33

c++ rules because of multiple inheritance, which i use extensively, along with template metaprogramming, which i use with multiple inheritance. 

Name: Anonymous 2006-08-17 2:24

>>5
You, sir, like everyone else, prefer C++--.

Take C++, keep the good features (most of which have been passed on to C99), and ditch classes (unless you get ahold of a garbage collector) and the needlessly complex stuff.

Name: Anonymous 2006-08-17 5:21

D makes a very nice substitute to C++--. Its main problem is that it's so new that the language is still in flux, but they finally seem to be making a push for 1.0. If you're a system programmer it's worth playing around with.

Unrelated, but >>7 probably faps to STL and cums over boost. Yeeeeeech.

Name: Anonymous 2006-08-17 8:11

>>9
I read a bit about D and it sounded great for C++--, but I believe I also read it sucks sure it's C improved, it has overloading, and garbage collection, but it's CLOSED SOURCE, which means it's PROPIETARY, or something along those lines. Are there freely available D compilers for Lunix and Win32, and can I build commercial software with them?

Name: Anonymous 2006-08-17 18:23

There are two compilers, GDC (http://dgcc.sourceforge.net/) and DMD (http://www.digitalmars.com/d/download.html).

Both are free (former as in speech, latter as in beer), and can be used to make commercial software. Since both use the same public domain frontend, they have similar bugcounts: http://dstress.kuehne.cn/www/dstress.html

However, the language is still very young. As much as I like it, I don't think you should write anything commercial in it just yet. Risk mitigation and all that.

tl;dr: yes, there are freely available compilers for linux and win32 that you can build commercial software with.

Name: Anonymous 2006-08-17 18:54

>>11
+1 Informative

Name: Anonymous 2006-08-17 19:43

Just because they crammed everything they could think of into it, doesn't make it a good language.

Name: Anonymous 2006-08-17 19:54

>>13 describes C++ perfectly.

Name: Anonymous 2006-08-17 20:39

Can anyone reccomend some good C books :)

Name: Anonymous 2006-08-17 20:41

>>15
K&R's The C Programming Language. Oldie, but goodie.

Name: Anonymous 2006-08-17 20:51

If you read the creator of C++'s page on C++ he mentions that his original idea had things like garbage collection and no pointers.  So basically his actual vision was for something more like java or C#.  As it happened C++ has pointers and no garbage collection....

as for the learning, just learn C++  seriously.  It will be more useful for writing everyday application than C and if you want to do some really low level stuff where C would be better suited... then you'll be able to learn C easy(assuming you've learned C++)

tl;dr

If you can learn one the other is easy to pickup so just go with C++ which you will probably see more code written in, etc.

Name: Anonymous 2006-08-17 21:38

Yes, please do learn C++. That way there will be less competition for the jobs where I don't want to gouge out my eyeballs.

Also, people like >>17 will be your colleages. Just think of all the fun you can have!

Name: Anonymous 2006-08-17 22:17

>>17
I SWEAR TO FUCKING GOD HOW FUCKING HARD IS IT TO CALL "DELETE" WHEN YOU ARE DONE WITH MEMORY, AND CREATE AND USE DESTRUCTORS.  IT'S COMPUTER PROGRAMMING, NOT FUCKING ROCKET SCIENCE OR BRAIN SURGERY.  FUCKING WHINEY "WAHH WAHH NO AUTOMATIC GARBAGE COLLECTION" NOOBS!

Name: Anonymous 2006-08-18 5:40

>>16
Anonymous approves!

>>17
If he knows C++, he BETTER KNOW C LIKE HIS FUCKING HOME, otherwise he's bound to fail.

>>18
Anonymous agrees, even if it's wicked.

>>19
When you overload =, have several references (which you shouldn't have to know about because of encapsulation), need to create and possibly return temporary copies, etc. what the fuck am I doing, this is an obvious troll.

Name: Anonymous 2006-08-18 15:53

AFDSAFSFASD

Name: Anonymous 2006-08-18 17:57

bump lol

Name: Anonymous 2006-08-19 5:39

>>20
OK, STILL, OVERLOADING OPERATORS, ETC. AND ALL THAT BS.  THAT IS WHY THERE ARE CONSTRUCTORS AND DESTRUCTORS.  PUT new IN THE CONSTRUCTOR AND delete IN THE DESTRUCTOR.  HOW FUCKING GODDAMN HARD IS THAT?

Name: Anonymous 2006-08-19 6:16

>>23
Some reading (a few hundred posts) is in order: http://groups.google.com.au/group/comp.lang.c++.moderated/browse_frm/thread/84253d37f970dd2b?hl=en&; It starts getting interesting around post 20 or so.

tl;dr: RAII ain't all that.

Name: Anonymous 2006-08-19 22:54

bump

Name: Anonymous 2006-08-19 23:44

>>24
Can you please make a slightly longer tl;dr version?

Name: Anonymous 2006-08-20 5:36

>>1

If you are a complete programming noob (javascript and that kind of shit don't really count), go with C++ first and try using C for file I/O. It's fairly common to do this. C++ isn't Java, but the syntax will help you out should you choose to get into Java later on.

Eclipse w/ CDT is a nice IDE to work with, try it out and good luck.

Name: Anonymous 2006-08-20 8:56

It's fairly common to do this. C++ isn't Java, but the syntax will help you out should you choose to get into Java later on.
Why would you want to do either of them?

That's like learning how to eat shit and drink piss when there's decent food only two tables over. Spare yourself.

Name: Anonymous 2006-08-20 10:02

You'll learn most of C in the process of learning C++.  Don't sweat the differences.

In fact, most C++ books and classes teach C more than C++ anyhow.

Name: Anonymous 2006-08-20 10:49

Name: Anonymous 2006-08-20 15:24 (sage)

>>28
is unemployed and lives in his parents dark basement

Name: 28 2006-08-20 18:26 (sage)

I'm gainfully employed, have been for years, and none of my jobs ever needed C++, Java, .NET, or whatever swill >>31 has been suffering through.

There are plenty of great jobs out there. It's not my fault if you can't find them (but thanks for leaving them for awesome old me!).

Name: Anonymous 2006-08-21 0:00

>>32

and may I know what language you have worked with?

PS: Don't reply with HTML is a programming language

Name: 28 2006-08-21 1:45 (sage)

In order: assembler, Perl, C, Python.

They once had me working with some legacy VB, which was ugly, but only for a short while.

Name: Anonymous 2006-08-21 18:44

Bump

Name: Anonymous 2006-08-21 22:28

* Learn C.
* Learn about object orientated programming.
* Implement object orientation in C.
* Decide: Do I really need C++?
* ...
* PROFIT!

Name: Anonymous 2006-08-21 22:40

>>34
So basically all the work you have done is insignificant.

Name: Anonymous 2006-08-22 2:30

>>37
If I get paid, and enjoy myself, why should I care if you think it's "significant"?

Enjoy your miserable life writing "significant" code in something enterprisey, Mr. Cog.

Name: Anonymous 2006-08-22 2:32

>>37
So basically all the posts you have written are trolls. If you think only Java and C++ is significant, then please continue thinking so; you'll be covering the jobs I don't want. We need people like you to satisfy professional enterprise scalable web 2.0 best practices design patterns glue managers.

I'm not >>34 BTW.

Name: Anonymous 2006-08-22 4:53

professional enterprise scalable web 2.0 best practices design patterns glue manager
If I ever have an office, I so want to make the plaque say that. Quoted 4tw.

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