Multiculturalism

Considering the problems it has been shown to cause, is it worth it?

In b4 racists, stormfags and anyone with a prejudiced opinion and little else.

>>38
"crime is at it's lowest levels ever". Lie, and even if it was it would be much lower without spics and blacks who commit most of the crime (look at the fucking statistics). You are retarded since you don't even understand these things. The fact is there are 10 times the number of people in prison than 50 years ago, keep lying to yourself that diversity is great.

>>40
Actually it was great, until serbs started to think that they were better than the rest...

>>41

your post contained the most fail i've ever seen. in 1900 1/2 of people in Boston used opium legally.  so yes more people are in prison, but that's because of drug laws.

and crime is at its lowest level ever. http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/glance.htm

and yes minorities commit more crime proportionally but most minorities aren't criminals.  keep crying faggot

>>43
Second time you link to figures that only go back to the 70s? Fail yet again. How about some figures on the number of people incarcerated? Locking up all the criminals is a good way to reduce crime and something the US has done right.
http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/glance/corrtyp.htm

>>44
Except it's expensive as shit to lock up that many people.  There are cheaper ways of reducing crime.  Better laws, better law enforcement, and education.

>>44

so my stats show an drop of over 2,000,000 incidents of serious violent crime annually; we are at the safest period in American history.  and your stats show that the an increased incarceration rate of 400,000 people, about 0.1% of the American population.

sounds like we're much safer, and for those who still commit crime it sounds like the system is working.  why are you bitching?

>go back to Econ 101 - there is no set number of jobs that can be drawn from.  the benefits immigrants bring to the table far outweigh the costs.  You have to think in terms of opportunity.

Net wealth for a country goes down drastically with many immigrants. There is no "benefit" to anyone except large industries in manufacturing and certain service sector jobs.
"The people" of said country get nothing, in fact it pushes down wages and (as in the case in England) makes things more unequal from richest to poorest, it drives up the price of every amenity people have to purchase.
You're completely ignoring the literal expansion in every sector of a country that is nescessary for mass immigration. Not to mention the hilariously expensive legal process involved with asylum seekers and then immigrants aswel.

>In the US the states with the highest percentage of immigrants have the lowest unemployment rates.  The reason is that a factory that would have cost to much to build before suddenly becomes affordable and springs up in Texas or California. hundreds of jobs are suddenly created that otherwise would not have been there.  this is a key reason you can't judge immigration on the costs.

USA is ligh years ahead of most countries

>also in the US, immigrants (illegal or not) commit crime at lower rates than citizens.

Links plz

>the U.K. is a fail country too xenophobic

lol the classic "racism" arguement. Don't be so stupid. The UK is an incredibly tolerant country. I myself am mixed race and I don't like what multiculturalism is doing to this counrty, strangly alot of people in a similar position as mine tend to agree.

>>39
>I just don't understand how you expect Britain (or Europe) to survive without immigration.

This is a completly idiotic statement. If you lower the cost of living more people will have children at a younger age, it is beacuse of the massive pressure on mainly the housing market that is caused by immigration that the birth rate is going down.

And why are we talking about crime statistics? Increased police effectiveness, better social sevices and education all make crime go down. Doesn't have anything to do with multiculturalism. More Bs argument that dont add up to squat from the liberals.

>>39
Immigration seems to be the government's short term solution of papering over cracks in it's deficiency in responding to an ageing population. I'm certainly no socio-economist, but surely the government should be thinking more in terms of promoting having more children in British couples with tax advantages and better financial support for couples with more than one child, and creating advertising campaigns and better informing the population of the need for more children. If I recall rightly something similar was attempted in France some years back with results I cannot remember.

The main cultural issues to be addressed is the complete lack of solidarity in the British people, and the unwillingness of many immigrants to assimilate. While British culture has always been one of being fairly aloof and cold in comparison to others, now British society raises people to believe that being white and having pride in being British (I'm only half white and not even born in the UK, yet because I am part of a predominantly white social group can sense the strength of this and feel it myself) has an immediate connotation with being racist (thank you BNP, thank you very much) and unless you are an apologetic liberal and have no qualms with anything done by those of a foreign culture or skin colour are viewed as having somewhat fascist tendencies, regardless of the objection. The politically correct environment is incredibly tedious too and is readily exploited by many minorities in the workplace, the justice system, and everyday life.

The unwillingness of minorities and immigrants to assimilate has never been much of a problem, but with the rapidly rising numbers it has become a cause for concern among many. While 'British' culture has the stigma attached to it, foreign cultures are protected and encouraged to thrive and all the while growing bigger with rising levels of immigration.

Even writing this I feel like a fascist even though broadly speaking I have liberal views and hate racism, have obviously not explored the huge issue fully. However, objectively speaking (as objective as you can get on social commentary at any rate) I think the majority of British born people, regardless of skin colour, who do not attribute themselves to a foreign culture would agree with most of these points. Again, feel free to point out any flaws, fallacies or inaccuracies in my post.

>>47
|Net wealth for a country goes down drastically with many immigrants. There is no "benefit" to anyone except large industries in manufacturing and certain service sector jobs.
I guess America's wealth is all just phantom.  Infact, the simplistic, unsourced, generalized immgiration axioms you lay out are so inaccurate with respect to the United States, I'm guessing this whole section of your post is about the European situation.  I would urge you to avoid making simplistic general statements in the future. Honestly, I don't know too much about the European situation other than what I read in the papers.  Seems like your options are pretty simple - either close or restrict immigration or find ways to better integrate people into society.  You seem to prefer the former even though the later is probably simpler and more beneficial to your country.  Remember, the point of immigration isn't for your country to be better now but to be in a better, more competitive position 25 years down the road.  You seem to be stuck in some sort of permanent nostalgia though.

|USA is ligh years ahead of most countries
care to explain?  the US isn't that different from Europe and yet we're doing much better.

|Links plz
a Harvard Study: http://contexts.org/articles/files/2008/01/contexts_winter08_sampson.pdf

|I myself am mixed race and I don't like what multiculturalism is doing to this counrty
you might actually try to articulate your specific concerns instead of casting them as wide, ambiguous threats.  I'm not even sure what points I'm supposed to be arguing here.

|If you lower the cost of living more people will have children at a younger age
Oh, OK.  Get on it then.  Sounds easy enough.

>>48
|Immigration seems to be the government's short term solution of papering over cracks in it's deficiency in responding to an ageing population.
So it's the government's role to convince white Brits to have more kids?   White Brits aren't having kids because they're spoiled and want to extend their carefree childhood into their mid-30s.  Economics has nothing to do with it.  If it did the birthrate during WW1 and WW2 would have been zero. You're engaged in a type of wishful thinking that is like pissing into the winds of social change.  Government policy has nothing to do with it, as long as your navel gazing, effeminate values continue, your native population will decline.

|The main cultural issues to be addressed is the complete lack of solidarity in the British people, and the unwillingness of many immigrants to assimilate.
I have yet to see any major British cultural export (TV shows, soccer, etc...) than isn't 100% white.  There will never be a British Barack Obama because your nation never had anything comparable to the civil rights movement.  When the Empire Windrush docked in 1948, one of your MPs suggested they would be on the first boat home!  Enoch Powell spews racism and gets 100,000 letters of support.  Your government policies force immigrants into vast ghettos. You throw bananas at your African soccer players for fucks sake!  I'm not suggesting that it all your fault, but there is nothing like the BNP in American political life.  You bringing up political correctness is a major Red Herring, because I see anti-immigrant sentiment expressed by Brits all the time.

This is a critical point. 

|While 'British' culture has the stigma attached to it, foreign cultures are protected and encouraged to thrive and all the while growing bigger with rising levels of immigration.
examples?  fuck.

You seem to have already made up you mind that immigration is a cancer on Britian, yet paradoxically you claim to be representative of a tolerant culture.  Why don't you just drop the veneer and say you want to drastically cut the immigration rate.  At least that way you'll be honest.  Who knows, maybe the rest of the country will go along with you.  It'll be interesting to see how you're doing in 50 years though.

"I think Enoch's right ... we should send them all back. Throw the wogs out! Keep Britain white!"

-Eric Clapton

>>50
You're being pretty presumptuous on the lifestyle of another nation and approaching it from a very US-centric viewpoint.

If it isn't the government's job to convince the native populace to have more children for national and economic interests then why is it their job to dictate how medical services, education, transport, lowering crime rates, or - rather saliently - immigration is to be handled? Surely this too is in the interests of the country is it not? Hell, why not have anarchy instead? Also note, the people of the UK are not my native populace, this isn't a 'keep the darkies out' rant nor am I trying to use my ethnicity to prove a point, it's for a little more impartiality on the subject of the racial side of the issue.

Secondly you are comparing the UK to the USA as if it is a model to be strived for. I don't want to start a petty UK vs US argument, but obviously the differences in the history and culture are grand, and minorities have not had as strong a hand in influencing popular UK culture as in America over the last century. How many years did it take to stop the persecution of blacks in America? Considering UK immigration only began in a larger scale post-WW2 if I'm correct I'd say the UK has done pretty well in striving for equality for immigrants and their families thus far. Just because a black prime minister is not as close to a black president does not mean the UK is 'behind' America, the amount of brown people in the House of Commons is not indicative of how progressive a country is.

Your arguments also seem to be a little outdated - Enoch Powell's controversial statement was in 1968 was it not? And the banana throwing incident was years ago and there has since been massive campaigns in football to reduce racism. As for the immigrants in ghettos, what is this? When was this? Immigrants usually end up in poor areas along with poor white English people because they are all poor as hell, it's not preferential treatment, it's logic. As for the BNP, they are one of the most widely hated groups of people in the UK and I don't know a single person who would admit to sympathising to their cause.

There has been a rise in anti-immigration sentiment for good reason (as explained in my previous post), not just simple bigotry and racism of people simply because they are different from yourself as the term 'anti-immigration' implies.

While 'British' culture has the stigma attached to it, foreign cultures are protected and encouraged to thrive and all the while growing bigger with rising levels of immigration.
examples?  fuck.
Unless you live in the UK I doubt you have little right to question this until you witness it yourself, I would have thought you'd seen the same effect in the US regarding minorities.

I do not think immigration is the cancer of Britain, I think mass immigration in a short space of time with little scope for assimilation and no regard for the conflicts it causes is the cancer on Britain. Change is inevitable, but to push it this fast is seriously inconsiderate to public opinion and national identity and solidarity. But to return to my first point, your answer was at best poor, do you have better response for it?

>>51
And that's why Clapton is a dick.

>>50
"I have yet to see any major British cultural export (TV shows, soccer, etc...) than isn't 100% white."
lol no, there's token blacks in every TV show now. Diversity is being rammed down our throats. The BBC is left-wing biased and pro-multiculturalism. As for "soccer" there's loads of players that are non-white, ever watch an Arsenal game? The fans love them all the same.

"There will never be a British Barack Obama because your nation never had anything comparable to the civil rights movement." And thank God for that. We've actually had a female and Jewish Prime Minister already, America needs to catch up.

"Enoch Powell spews racism and gets 100,000 letters of support." I don't think he said anything disparaging of other races,  but he was too frank and rhetorical and got burned by political correctness.

"Your government policies force immigrants into vast ghettos." lol wut? You take third world unskilled (often illegal) immigrants what do you expect? Last I checked the Polish aren't doing too bad, and the Chinese and Indians earn more on average than Brits.

"there is nothing like the BNP in American political life."
BNP are a non-entity in British political life, they have no MPs. They are only brought up by the left, who compare anyone who is anti-immigration to the BNP to defame them.

GDP per capita in the UK. We're so racist right? Holding our minorities back?

1     Indian     £30,211
2     Chinese     £25,964
3     Pakistani     £24,917
4     White     £24,756
5     National average     £24,568
6     Any other ethnic group     £23,350
7     Black African     £23,109
8     Black Caribbean     £22,902
9     Bangladeshi     £18,209

>>51

he's back traced on that but still feels that "inviting" non-whites to work for them is entrapment and they end up living in ghetto's and complaining. sounds logical now, but no one is sure of the sentiment Enoch was speaking racist or sympathetic towards poor non-whites. at least powell dug out the racist and exposed them (for support? not sure).it helped ease the already racist tensions that were growing by showing support for minorities and not powell. sure clapton was high when he said that but at least he's not a political figure so no one listened.