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why do libertarians ignore 16th amendment?

Name: Anonymous 2008-01-08 13:50

they are willfully blind to the fact that the constitution has been amended to allow for income tax.

Name: Anonymous 2008-01-08 15:19

1) The amendment was, er, amended in a peculiar manner if you look at its history.
2) We don't, we want to amend the Constitution in order to nullify it. We certainly don't want to "ignore" it.

Name: Anonymous 2008-01-10 2:54

A tax on one's income is immoral and illogical.  It's like being penalized for working.  And it's essentially done at gun point.  Don't pay, you go to jail.  Absolute faggotry of the highest degree. 

Federal income tax is basically like a school yard bully demanding your lunch money.  He has no right to it, but if you don't give it to him you'll get beat up.

I'd invite the government to do 1/4 of my work for that 1/4 of my paycheck, but then that shit would never get done.

Name: Anonymous 2008-01-10 3:30

Name: Anonymous 2008-01-11 0:01

the 16th amendment was never ratified by sufficient number of states

Name: Anonymous 2008-01-11 0:18

>>3
of course, we could just be another shit hole like Mexico.  That's the difference between places like the EU and shit holes like Central America.

Taxes pay for all that infrastucture so we don't have to live in our own filth.

dumb motherfuckers like you whining about taxes being bad and unfair are the same assholes who'd complain about shitty schools and fucked up roads when taxes are gone.

do us all a favor and shut the fuck up.

Name: Anonymous 2008-01-11 0:26

>>6
Yeah. Because income tax pays for schools and and roads, amirite?
Also, state-sponsored, compulsory manufactured education can never be effective.

Name: Anonymous 2008-01-11 2:31

>>6
No one said all taxes are bad.  Just INCOME tax.  None of what you pay in income tax goes toward providing a service of any kind.  Click on that link >>4 posted.  And watch it.

But I can already tell you're a libfag who thinks taxes are the only way to fix anything, because as soon as you see an opinion you don't like you scream "SHUT UP!" because it's too difficult to have a real discussion.

Name: Anonymous 2008-01-11 9:34

>>5

Yes it was

Name: Anonymous 2008-01-11 18:38

Name: Anonymous 2008-01-13 18:45

>>10

http://evans-legal.com/dan/tpfaq.html#ratification

“Thomas is a tax protester, and one of his arguments is that he did not need to file tax returns because the sixteenth amendment is not part of the constitution. It was not properly ratified, Thomas insists, repeating the argument of W. Benson & M. Beckman, The Law That Never Was (1985). Benson and Beckman review the documents concerning the states’ ratification of the sixteenth amendment and conclude that only four states ratified the sixteenth amendment; they insist that the official promulgation of that amendment by Secretary of State Knox in 1913 is therefore void.

“Benson and Beckman did not discover anything; they rediscovered something that Secretary Knox considered in 1913. Thirty-eight states ratified the sixteenth amendment, and thirty-seven sent formal instruments of ratification to the Secretary of State. (Minnesota notified the Secretary orally, and additional states ratified later; we consider only those Secretary Knox considered.) Only four instruments repeat the language of the sixteenth amendment exactly as Congress approved it. The others contain errors of diction, capitalization, punctuation, and spelling. The text Congress transmitted to the states was: “The Congress shall have power to lay and collect taxes on incomes, from whatever source derived, without apportionment among the several States, and without regard to any census or enumeration.” Many of the instruments neglected to capitalize “States,” and some capitalized other words instead. The instrument from Illinois had “remuneration” in place of “enumeration”; the instrument from Missouri substituted “levy” for “lay”; the instrument from Washington had “income” not “incomes”; others made similar blunders.

“Thomas insists that because the states did not approve exactly the same text, the amendment did not go into effect. Secretary Knox considered this argument. The Solicitor of the Department of State drew up a list of the errors in the instruments and--taking into account both the triviality of the deviations and the treatment of earlier amendments that had experienced more substantial problems--advised the Secretary that he was authorized to declare the amendment adopted. The Secretary did so.

“Although Thomas urges us to take the view of several state courts that only agreement on the literal text may make a legal document effective, the Supreme Court follows the “enrolled bill rule.” If a legislative document is authenticated in regular form by the appropriate officials, the court treats that document as properly adopted. Field v. Clark, 143 U.S. 649, 36 L.Ed. 294, 12 S.Ct. 495 (1892). The principle is equally applicable to constitutional amendments. See Leser v. Garnett, 258 U.S. 130, 66 L.Ed. 505, 42 S.Ct. 217 (1922), which treats as conclusive the declaration of the Secretary of State that the nineteenth amendment had been adopted. In United States v. Foster, 789 F.2d. 457, 462-463, n.6 (7th Cir. 1986), we relied on Leser, as well as the inconsequential nature of the objections in the face of the 73-year acceptance of the effectiveness of the sixteenth amendment, to reject a claim similar to Thomas’. See also Coleman v. Miller, 307 U.S. 433, 83 L. Ed. 1385, 59 S. Ct. 972 (1939) (questions about ratification of amendments may be nonjusticiable). Secretary Knox declared that enough states had ratified the sixteenth amendment. The Secretary’ decision is not transparently defective. We need not decide when, if ever, such a decision may be reviewed in order to know that Secretary Knox’ decision is now beyond review.”


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