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A New Threat to Civil Liberties

Name: Anonymous 2007-01-09 3:02

Consider for a moment if, as the leftists want, we socialize health care. 

What will this lead to? Obviously, the state would be playing a larger role in the health care industry, possibly even running the whole thing itself.  But the important thing is who picks up the tab.  As long as the individual, not the state, is paying his own bills, it is fine to say he should be able to take whatever risky decisions he wants to with his body, since he is paying his own bills for the possible results of said risky decisions. 

In a socialized health system, where health care is 'free', and no individual is paying his own bill individually, there is a present and great incentive for the people to vote for infringements of civil liberties - to ban certain activities that, in a capitalistic health care system would be entirely acceptable due to the fact that the individual is picking up his own bill.

If you are a civil liberties advocate who cares little about economic freedom, you should consider this before you join the ranks of the socialized medicine supporters.  Once socialized health care gets passed, you will find yourself fighting an uphill battle to protect a great many non-economic freedoms.

For a quick example.  If health care is socialized, there will be an increasing incentive for the state to ban smoking or drinking because it is very unhealthy. 

In a socialist system, the state must pay the bills of the people who drinks or smokes, not the individual.  The result? In a universal health care system, the public has an interest in somehow forcing you to act the way they want you to - an incentive they would not have in a capitalistic system.

This line of thinking, when combined with a socialized universal health care system would, without a doubt, lead to more infringements of personal freedom and choice down the road.  Freedoms that you take for granted now to do all manner of unhealthy things from smoking to drinking to eating ice cream or  engaging in any other unhealthy activity if you want are suddenly more likely to be in the crosshairs of public debate in the future, if socialized health care is implimented. 

Any personal freedom that is unhealthy will be up in the air as long as it is arguable that it is likely to result in the state paying some form of bill or other, rather than the individual taking the risk.  Socialist health care will invariably lead to a reduction of personal freedom and choice in our society, if implimented. 

Name: Anonymous 2007-01-10 8:15

>>12
"I live in australia, which does have socialised medicine. We have lost no freedoms,"

Australia has lost no freedoms? Really? Hmm, what's this?

http://www.newsmax.com/articles/?a=2000/6/26/12629
http://www.gunowners.org/hlr-au.htm
http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/HL0601/S00228.htm
http://www.wsws.org/articles/2003/jul2003/asio-j01.shtml
http://www.worldpress.org/Asia/2177.cfm
http://www.computerworld.com/securitytopics/security/story/0,10801,105427,00.html

"we just have free (well we pay taxes) medical care."

Yeah, so its free (well, you have to pay for it), medical care.  Spectacular!

"Old or young, rich or poor, if we are sick, we go to the doctor. I know, that sounds horrible!"

I can't speak for everyone else, but I have no problem paying my medical bills here in the USA.  If you work hard here, you can get ahead... and that leads to..guess what.. the ability to pay your bills and live comfortably! *SURPRISE!*

"Maybe we should live in America and have the government pass the Patriot Act instead (i can only assume that the original statement was from a sadly uninformed American....seems to be the norm)"

Or maybe we should live in Australia so we can loose all our civil liberties, have legislation comparable to the patriot act passed while we apparently aren't even aware of it, then hop on the internet and critisize the supposedly misinformed americans like myself. 

"PS i am a former US military member (vet Gulf War) who has been living in OZ for 12 years now, and have seen the light about the rest of the world and the idiocy of the US gov't. So there."

Whoa, I'm not saying our government doesn't do a lot of stupid shit.  I am perfectly ready to recognize that a lot of government programs (much like the ones you have in australia, and alike many we have here) are completely full of shit and should be rolled back.  This is one of the many reasons I am happy to call myself a libertarian, rather than a misinformed australian government suck up like yourself.

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