America is neither a democracy nor a republic

Let's face it, the system is clearly broken and not doing what it's suppose to be doing.

We put up the great facade of Democracy, but the only thing that really makes decisions in this country is money.  None of our 'representitives' represent us or our desires.  Every asshat politician spends more time trying to buff their image and get re-elected than they do actually helping the nation.  So, I have a few proposals.

1.  Any government employee with any sort of power should be barred from having any other jobs or sources of income, including stocks.  Government officals receive more than enough money for what they do and they shouldn't concern themselves with anything other than obeying their constituants.  By cutting off the possiblity of them making money from other interests there's a much lower possibility of corruption and bribery, and lobbiest influence.

2.  Any person convicted of a crime, even a misdamenor, should be ineligable for public office.  No exceptions.

3.  Government officials who don't carry out the will of their constituants should be removed from office immediately.  Fuck waiting for an election.  Waiting just gives them more time to do a shitty job.  (See Iraq war for details)

4.  All public officals should have their telephone conversations recorded in the event an investigation is needed.  If they're not doing anything shady they've got nothing to worry about.  And fuck privacy.  Anyone with power in the government should be watched like a hawk.  It makes more sense than having the government spy on its citizens.


[/rant]

If your elected officials require this type of rule set in order to perform there job, don’t you think that questioning the actual system is more appropriate? Politicians are normal people given unjust power...that’s the root of America’s problems. Stop trying to put a square block into a round hole, any course of action forcing this to work only creates more problem and contradictions, and in the end something will break



 Vote libertarian 08!

lower government pay substantially. you gotta be in office because you wanna serve the people, not because you get a cushy job with long term job security and high pay.

major campaign finance reform. all elections should be publically funded, and that's it. You work with what you're given by the people that want you in office. not getting enough money? dig into your own wallet or form some donation event or something.

no more than two consecutive house/senate terms. you can come back for a third term, but not in a row. try again next 4 years or something.


Also, as a side note, supreme court has got to stop reaching out of it's bounderies and ruling on shit that's got nothing to do with their job. It's the highest court in the land, but it's the highest only because it rules on the constitutionality of laws, nothing else. If it doesn't have to do with a law and whether or not it's constitutional, they dont get to touch it. Why the supreme court had anything to do with the 2001 election shit is beyond me.

>>1
>>3
wow you two are pathetic

>>4
No one cares about your half sentence that has no explaination.  gtfo 14 year old.

>>5
Said the pot to the kettle.

>>6 That's a more academical way of saying "takes one to know one! ROTFL!".

>>7

And "academical" is just a fancy way of saying "I shouldn't have slept through fucking English! LOL."

Die, thread, die.

I would have to disagree.  I believe that America is the greatest nation on Earth, because of its immense amount of money and freedom.  Let's face it, Swedes/Canadians/Australians: You're all a bunch of liberal fallacy; America is and has always been the richest society in the history of the world.  Check the facts, people.  Also, checks and balances between the judicial, legislative, and executive branches limit any side from getting too much power.  If you people think things aren't getting done well, send a letter to a dang congressman.  Better yet, run for a place in office and change the laws yourselves if you don't like them.  If your ideas are good enough, enough people will vote for you so that said laws can be instilled in to order.  All of the above posts are a bunch of hippie propaganda pretending that America is Fascist when it was THE FIRST DEMOCRACY and is the RICHEST COUNTRY ON EARTH.  TAKE THAT, YOU SELF RIGHTEOUS SWEDES/CANADIANS/AUSTRALIANS.  YEAH. [/rant]

>>9
I like America a good deal but just because we were the first to do something doesn’t exempt us from criticism.

"All of the above posts are a bunch of hippie propaganda pretending that America is Fascist when it was THE FIRST DEMOCRACY"

 Gb2 /high school/ America was not even close to the first democracy, it was however the first free country but dont confuse the terms, they are very different.

"Also, checks and balances between the judicial, legislative, and executive branches limit any side from getting too much power."

They are good at protecting any one branch from seizing to much power, but when the entire government becomes more bloated and powerful we run into many different problems that most people do not want to face.

"If you people think things aren't getting done well, send a letter to a dang congressman."

Congressman aren’t concerned with letters, votes and money are the only means to reach them (or lack of)

>>8 Shall we hold a funeral for the thread?

>>1 and >>3 are totally right. Anyone who has disagreed thus far hasn't given a point-by-point reason that these things shouldn't take place and the reason for that can be boiled down to product loyality. (Putting it bluntly, in capitalists terms) You people put politiciains above the interests of human society and express only a desire to see "the team you picked" win out over all others. You're pathetic and everything that you do runs alien to human progress.

Rome was the first democracy that I can remember... The USA is a republican state with democratic tendencies, for good reason, as democracy is often a bad thing (considering 90% of people's IQs are below 120)

the USA is a fucktardocracy. proff: Dumbya.

>>14
Actually, more formally, the USA is a crap vs cunt ocracy. The 2 major US political parties are in fact code for these 2 vulgar terms.

Fuck those two parties , my bets going to the us marijuana party http://www.usmjparty.com/

Ok well you asked for it, a point by point rebuttal


Let's face it, the system is clearly broken and not doing what it's suppose to be doing.

So your plan is to take that same system and impose greater surveillance and strict guidelines, do you even relies the slippery slope you’re standing on?


We put up the great facade of Democracy, but the only thing that really makes decisions in this country is money.  None of our 'representitives' represent us or our desires.  Every asshat politician spends more time trying to buff their image and get re-elected than they do actually helping the nation.  So, I have a few proposals.

Democracy has nothing to do with money, we have a democracy, we have exactly what we asked for. A bloated mixed economy that’s extremely prone to capitalist influences that can only destroy and are capably of no good. When government is allowed to share the reigns of power with business, it will always end in disaster; you cant change this, no amount of regulation can.

1.  Any government employee with any sort of power should be barred from having any other jobs or sources of income, including stocks.  Government officials receive more than enough money for what they do and they shouldn't concern themselves with anything other than obeying their constituents.  By cutting off the possiblity of them making money from other interests there's a much lower possibility of corruption and bribery, and lobbiest influence.

What better way to coerce great minds to serve the public good then to offer them zero incentives. Enjoy your government run by community college hipsters and grungy hippies; let’s see how that works out. Once again you’re diagnosing a disease and treating the symptoms, the problem is not the politicians, it’s the system itself. Government cannot have a hold on economic policies; it should be a separate entity.
 
2.  Any person convicted of a crime, even a misdamenor, should be ineligible for public office.  No exceptions.
Y
ea I mean zero tolerance works phenomenally well in all situations. If the system is so broken, why would you trust it to dictate the moral premises that supersede being elected? The great circle of bullshit is now in full view

3.  Government officials who don't carry out the will of their constituents should be removed from office immediately.  Fuck waiting for an election.  Waiting just gives them more time to do a shitty job.  (See Iraq war for details)

Why not just elect mindless monkeys to run the country (in before we already do)? Why not instill a direct democracy instead? We can take polls before any action by the government is taken; or we could not fucking depend on government so much.

4.    All public officials should have their telephone conversations recorded in the event an investigation is needed.  If they're not doing anything shady they've got nothing to worry about.  And fuck privacy.  Anyone with power in the government should be watched like a hawk.  It makes more sense than having the government spy on its citizens.

The slope your standing on goes directly into the collective mind’s of Stalin, Hitler, Mao and other monsters of our time. The sad part is your probably can’t even foresee the type of action this form of situational ethics sanctions.

I only have a problem with two
What if that person commits a crime of civil disobedience?

shoot him

Just shoot all the bureaucrats until they shape up. It only costs a few cents a pop and they'll be scared shitless.

saddly america during the last 4 years looks more and more like a plutocracy or a oligarchy

>>13
wasn't Greece the first democracy? why would we use a Greek word for democracy? demos - people kratein - rule/government

>>22
Greece was the first proto-democracy since voting wasn't universal.

>>1

Wow, now just show how any of those things could work without viciously compromising every concept you claim to be standing for and some of us might stop sighing and looking skyward.

What citizen is going to work in government if it means some of the basic rights of citizenship will be compromised? And how do you propose to create a procedure which allows this sort of 'instant removal'?

>>24
I am not the OP, but if you have power over people, it it those people's right to ensure preventative measures against the misuse of that power. This is the same reasonning that justifies gun rights. If criminals can buy guns easily on the black market and always will it is your human right to be able to possess arms also. If politicians can corrupt the democratic process easily and always will be in a position to do so, it is your human right to see that increased law enforcement is directed towards them to ensure they carry out the will of the people and nothing but the will of the people.

I disagree with the OP's points 1 and 2.

>>3
a few thinngs.

>lower government pay substantially. you gotta be in office because you wanna serve the people, not because you get a cushy job with long term job security and high pay.

BRIBES FOR UNDERPAID POLITICIANS. USE YOUR BRAIN.

>major campaign finance reform. all elections should be publically funded, and that's it. You work with what you're given by the people that want you in office. not getting enough money? dig into your own wallet or form some donation event or something.

DIG INTO THEIR OWN WALLETS? HOW IS THAT PUBLICALLY FUNDED? BILL GATES RUNS FOR PRESIDENT. DONATION DRIVES? JUST WHAT THE HELL DOES PUBLICALLY FUNDED MEAN? MAKE CLEAR AND CONCISE POINTS. DON'T BE VAGUE.

This entire point is just too vague to attack. It doesn't even deal with the mechanisms of campaign financing, or it takes very simple and broad concepts into account.

>no more than two consecutive house/senate terms. you can come back for a third term, but not in a row. try again next 4 years or something.

I can't think of much wrong with this but that doesn't mean there's nothing wrong with it. IMO, not bad.

>Also, as a side note, supreme court has got to stop reaching out of it's bounderies and ruling on shit that's got nothing to do with their job. It's the highest court in the land, but it's the highest only because it rules on the constitutionality of laws, nothing else. If it doesn't have to do with a law and whether or not it's constitutional, they dont get to touch it. Why the supreme court had anything to do with the 2001 election shit is beyond me.

Doesn't seem like a very flawed idea to me either.