[“None of us had arms and we were not able to resist the attack.” One under-armed villager lamented: “I tried to take my spear to protect my family, but they threatened me with a gun, so I stopped. The six Arabs then raped my daughter in front of me, my wife and my other children.”]
Name:
Xel2006-08-22 14:50
"I'm not gonna 'put up or shut up' as long as you are bashing freedom-promoting american policies, while at the same time condoning the U.N., an anti-freedom, anti-2nd amendment, anti-human rights organization." I don't condone the entirety of the UN, but America can't say shit while it is using terrorist tactics, which hasn't done anything for freedom in Cuba. Then there are all the tortured people in Egypt, Chile and Iran.
"Individual rights shouldn't be allowed to be subjugated to the will of the many. This is just mob rule, regardless of basic inalienable human rights, such as property, and puts them in line with all the other vicious tyrannies of history, like China, the Soviet Union, etc." I didn't say this gave the regime any ethical elevation or credibility, but that this is the reason why America resorted to civilian-targetting tactics - no right-wing guerillas to support, so you attack the population directly.
"I see. You hate america because we can't patch up *every* boo-boo in the world." I don't hate America, and I think it is a bit odd that a right-wing president who betrays democratic principles gets away scot-free.
"No, I wasn't aware. Well fuck the U.N. then." I can't disagree or agree yet.
"Talking about us funding the Afghanis against the Soviets? Common, don't make this too easy. The Soviets were the biggest mass-murders in all human history. They killed even more than the Socialist Nazis and Chinese. It was clearly justified, even if the people we were aiding weren't squeaky clean themselves." I approve of the principle that America should outsource the resistance to undemocratic enemies. If those you side with are unsqueaky enough to fly planes into buildings inside your borders you may want to think through who you deal with.
"Pro-gunners shouldn't have to fund anti-gun organizations like IANSA." The crusade on drugs is not libertarian, so no more taxes for the crime-fighting sector.
" I guess you wouldn't mind throwing some research money at the NRA and JPFO as well, right? They do research into how PRO-GUN policies save lives and make the world a better place. I'm not talking a small amount of money, either. IANSA and these NGOs get huge sums of money - there are over 500 of them that are anti-gun and are getting funding." Of course not, because I am not anti-gun, I am pro-information.
"Yes they will. IANSA is an anti-gun organization, and Rebecca Peters, the director of this organization, is one of the most vicious anti-gunners I have ever seen or heard of. Hell, she has advocated banning 'sniper rifles' (to her, means any rifle capable of shooting over 100 meters). Yeah, forget that this encompasses just about every decent rifle in existence.. (Note for hunters: you obviously aren't immune from this), as well as a global ban on handguns." This global ban is something I am very much against, because this should not apply to America. Regarding the 100-meter limit I find that very silly, considering that even if you limited purchase of these to hunters people that don't hunt would still be able to get a hold.
"I don't need to. The USA said it is going to arm freedom and liberty supporters. Anyway, on a side note, are you against all military action that then effects civilians? Note: we have many cases like this coming from Iraq, which you support, if I recall correctly." I am against any faction that do not have a principle to avoid civilian suffering. As such I think Hamas, Fatah Hezbollah and maybe even the Tamil Tigers to be of questionable morality. The American army does not target civilians, which most if not all resistance factions in Africa do, even though sometimes it is hard to make a distinction.
"Attacking civilians is something that commonly happens often. Civilian casualties are an unfortunate side effect of most conflicts. Anyhow, most of these governments perform similar actions, so usage of the same tactics to bring them down is possibly justified anyways, if it brings a stop to it all." Give an example where an armed faction was succesful in dismantling an oppressive force and then starting adequate democracies themselves.
"Nextly, just because a nation is 'democratic' doesn't mean we shouldn't arm resistors to it. If a nation hostile to the USA that would fund terrorists to fight us is elected, for example, it could warrant our action on the matter." See above.
"Well great! So I guess you don't know whether or not you are advocating disarming people who really shouldn't have guns, or if you are advocating disarming pro-freedom/liberty revolutionaries." I am far from convinced, I just look at what guns are used for in developing nations.
"If it was proven, take it to the courts, or do something about it. There is often dirty shit pulled by either party, this is nothing new. I think elections are mostly fair though. I WILL say that I hold some degree of distrust of electronic voting. Electronic voting should be avoided, but I'm not ready to say I think the elections were a 'sham' by any means. Dirty tricks doesn't necessarilly = staged elections." These dirty tricks are the tip of the iceberg. Diebold, the company, was present in Florida and Ohio and both times there were irregularities and direct deletion of votes. All of the votes disappearing were for Gore, how convenient.
"I don't know that they wouldn't use rape and terror against civilians as a weapon. Against tyrannical and unjust governments that likely do the same, if not worse things, it may be justified if it results in the defeat of said government, and the end of its awful policies." Sure. Provide a situation where raping a woman at gunpoint could poosibly provide a boost to freedom fighters. And give a reason as to why a resistance movement that gladly uses rape as a weapon has the moral, intellectual, ethical or even human faculties required to create a better state once the current oppressors are gone.